I would like to connect a Sun 411 external HD to an Ultra 60 and would
like to verify this will work before purchasing an adapter.
If I understand correctly the 411 has a DB50 female connector and the
Ultra has a DB68 female connector and the 411 cable is DB50 male on
both ends. As such I'm thinking a DB50(female) to DB68 (male) adapter
plugged into the Ultra will make this work? I'm seeing some adapters
that claim to have a "high byte terminator" or others that are
marketed as a "terminated adapter" is this what I'm looking for? I do
have a terminator for the 411.
And finally - Some adapters are listed as HPDB50 or DPDB68 - is this
the same as the DB50 or DB68?
Thanks for your input - for some reason I find the various SCSI
terminology confusing.
Jack Wagner <jack.wagner@gmail.com> writes:
>I would like to connect a Sun 411 external HD to an Ultra 60 and would
>like to verify this will work before purchasing an adapter.
>If I understand correctly the 411 has a DB50 female connector and the
>Ultra has a DB68 female connector and the 411 cable is DB50 male on
>both ends. As such I'm thinking a DB50(female) to DB68 (male) adapter
>plugged into the Ultra will make this work? I'm seeing some adapters
>that claim to have a "high byte terminator" or others that are
>marketed as a "terminated adapter" is this what I'm looking for? I do
>have a terminator for the 411.
Either a wide to narrow adaptor, or rather than mess with yet another
thing in the chain, I'd just get a wide to narrow cable.
I have never ordered from this place, just one of the higher up stores
that popped up in google..
HD68 to HD50 SCSI cable with high-byte termination. $42.50 for 3'.
(C4030-3PAM-AT).
THe high-byte termination is in reguard to the changing width of the bus.
Narrow SCSI (HD50) is 8-bits wide. Wide SCSI (HD68) is 16-bits
wide. Since the SCSI bus needs to be terminated, this cable (or an adaptor)
needs to terminate the un-used high 8-bits of the SCSI cable back to
the SCSI HBA.
>And finally - Some adapters are listed as HPDB50 or DPDB68 - is this
>the same as the DB50 or DB68?
There's no such thing as DB50 or DB68. There's DD50 (double D) that
was used for the earliest SCSI on SUN connectors. I still have a Sun
shoebox with its DD50 cable. The high-density SCSI connectors are
called HD50 or HD68. Some people see a D type connector on a cable and
call everything DBxx whereas DB25 is the only valid one.
>Thanks for your input - for some reason I find the various SCSI
>terminology confusing.
Just terminology to learn. Wait until you get to the differences in
LVD and HVD.. The site I referenced appears to have a pretty good
set of correct information.
On Dec 4, 10:39 am, Doug McIntyre <mer...@geeks.org> wrote:
> Jack Wagner <jack.wag...@gmail.com> writes:
>
> >I would like to connect a Sun 411 external HD to an Ultra 60 and would
> >like to verify this will work before purchasing an adapter.
> >If I understand correctly the 411 has a DB50 female connector and the
> >Ultra has a DB68 female connector and the 411 cable is DB50 male on
> >both ends. As such I'm thinking a DB50(female) to DB68 (male) adapter
> >plugged into the Ultra will make this work? I'm seeing some adapters
> >that claim to have a "high byte terminator" or others that are
> >marketed as a "terminated adapter" is this what I'm looking for? I do
> >have a terminator for the 411.
>
> Either a wide to narrow adaptor, or rather than mess with yet another
> thing in the chain, I'd just get a wide to narrow cable.
>
> I have never ordered from this place, just one of the higher up stores
> that popped up in google..
>
> http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/scsi_cables.html
>
> HD68 to HD50 SCSI cable with high-byte termination. $42.50 for 3'.
> (C4030-3PAM-AT).
>
> THe high-byte termination is in reguard to the changing width of the bus.
> Narrow SCSI (HD50) is 8-bits wide. Wide SCSI (HD68) is 16-bits
> wide. Since the SCSI bus needs to be terminated, this cable (or an adaptor)
> needs to terminate the un-used high 8-bits of the SCSI cable back to
> the SCSI HBA.
>
> >And finally - Some adapters are listed as HPDB50 or DPDB68 - is this
> >the same as the DB50 or DB68?
>
> There's no such thing as DB50 or DB68. There's DD50 (double D) that
> was used for the earliest SCSI on SUN connectors. I still have a Sun
> shoebox with its DD50 cable. The high-density SCSI connectors are
> called HD50 or HD68. Some people see a D type connector on a cable and
> call everything DBxx whereas DB25 is the only valid one.
Thanks for the clarification. I think I'll have a look at ebay for a
cable.
Jack Wagner <jack.wagner@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Dec 4, 11:00 am, Jack Wagner <jack.wag...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Thanks for the clarification. I think I'll have a look at ebay for a
>> cable.
>
> As a final follow-up I found a 3 FT. cable (new) from an ebay store
> for $8.99!
On Dec 4, 12:14 pm, Cydrome Leader <prese...@MUNGEpanix.com> wrote:
> Jack Wagner <jack.wag...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > On Dec 4, 11:00 am, Jack Wagner <jack.wag...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >> Thanks for the clarification. I think I'll have a look at ebay for a
> >> cable.
>
> > As a final follow-up I found a 3 FT. cable (new) from an ebay store
> > for $8.99!
>
> was shipping $34.99 + insurance + $8 handling?
>
> just kidding.
Aye - I hate people who try to do that. Actually shipping was $5.99
(USPS) and it's shipping from one state over so I'll likely see it in
a couple days. A fair deal by all accounts.
On 2007-12-04, Jack Wagner <jack.wagner@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hello,
>
> I would like to connect a Sun 411 external HD to an Ultra 60 and would
> like to verify this will work before purchasing an adapter.
>
> If I understand correctly the 411 has a DB50 female connector and the
> Ultra has a DB68 female connector and the 411 cable is DB50 male on
> both ends. As such I'm thinking a DB50(female) to DB68 (male) adapter
Hmm ... those connector names are wrong -- but there are people
calling almost any connector computer related "DB" -- even though they
aren't. The "DB" gives the shell size of the D style connector with
round pins. DB-25 in particular. Other pin counts in other shell sizes
have other second letters -- the DD-50 for example.
However -- these connectors are a totally different series, not
the 'D' series at all. The 50-pin connector is often called just the
"SCSI-II connector", though I think that is wrong, too. :-) What you are
looking at are the "HD-50" and HD-68" connectors.
> plugged into the Ultra will make this work? I'm seeing some adapters
> that claim to have a "high byte terminator" or others that are
> marketed as a "terminated adapter" is this what I'm looking for? I do
> have a terminator for the 411.
The "high byte terminator" is needed when transitioning from a
68-pin device to a 50-pin device -- if it is not provided by the device
itself. For example, the Unipack and Multipack housings (the Unipack is
the 68-pin equivalent of your 411) are designed to automatically
terminate either both halves of the SCSI, or just the high byte if
either there is nothing connected beyond the box or if there is a 68-pin
to 50-pin cable. (The latter case handles the high byte termination,
while whatever is connected to the 50-pin end of the cable should take
care of terminating the low byte. In the case of the 411, you will want
an external terminator on the other connector.
However -- the Ultra-60's 68-pin connector on the back connects
to no drives inside the box. It is a totally separate SCSI bus from the
one used inside the box for the two disk drives and the CD-ROM drive.
So -- as long as what you are connecting to it is only a 50-pin
device (or even a chain of them) you don't need to worry about the high
byte. Just get a 68-pin to 50-pin SCSI cable.
A quick eBay search finds auction 230199136497 as the first
offering such a cable. This one is a 12-foot one, and you probably want
a shorter one. Auction 120190305633 contains a 3-foot one which is
probably a better bet.
No idea what the vendors
are like. Avoid any which call themselves "VHDCI 68 pin" as those won't
fit the connector which you have.
> And finally - Some adapters are listed as HPDB50 or DPDB68 - is this
> the same as the DB50 or DB68?
No idea -- since the DB50 and DB68 are undefined and may be
totally unsuitable anyway. The first thing I found searching on:
SCSI cable DB50
is actually the D*D*50 -- a very old SCSI cable used in the Sun-3
machines. Anything later uses the HD-50 or HD-68 -- or on PCI cards,
the VHDCI-68.
> Thanks for your input - for some reason I find the various SCSI
> terminology confusing.
It is made worse by the incorrect nomenclature used by the eBay
vendors.
BTW -- when you get some 68-pin devices to add to your
collection, make your 50-pin the last thing in the chain. If you put it
in the middle of the chain, you will confuse the system with later
devices saying "I'm a wide device" through the 50 pin connector, after
which the system will try to talk to it wide, and fail, and you'll have
lots of retires before it falls back to narrow.
And drives which are 68-pin or 80-pin (like the SCA drives
inside the system box) will be *much* faster than the 50-pin devices, so
you will proably want to move to the wider devices as soon as possible.
(also -- you can get much more capacity in the 68-pin drives than in the
50-pin drives. I think that my largest 50-pin drive is only 4GB, and
I've got 68-pin drives up to 50 GB, and I know that even larger are
available.
Good Luck,
DoN.
--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
On 2007-12-04, Doug McIntyre <merlyn@geeks.org> wrote:
> Jack Wagner <jack.wagner@gmail.com> writes:
[ ... ]
>>And finally - Some adapters are listed as HPDB50 or DPDB68 - is this
>>the same as the DB50 or DB68?
>
> There's no such thing as DB50 or DB68. There's DD50 (double D) that
> was used for the earliest SCSI on SUN connectors. I still have a Sun
> shoebox with its DD50 cable. The high-density SCSI connectors are
> called HD50 or HD68. Some people see a D type connector on a cable and
> call everything DBxx whereas DB25 is the only valid one.
Close -- but there *is* such a thing as a DB50. The same D
sized shell as the DB-25, but three rows of fifty very tiny pins. It is
quite uncommon, but I do have some. It is sort of related to the 15-pin
connector used for VGA monitor cables -- but longer.
>>Thanks for your input - for some reason I find the various SCSI
>>terminology confusing.
>
> Just terminology to learn. Wait until you get to the differences in
> LVD and HVD..
:-)
Good Luck,
DoN.
--
Email: <dnichols@d-and-d.com> | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564
(too) near Washington D.C. | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html
--- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero ---
On Dec 4, 11:33 pm, "DoN. Nichols" <dnich...@d-and-d.com> wrote:
> On 2007-12-04, Jack Wagner <jack.wag...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Hello,
>
> > I would like to connect a Sun 411 external HD to an Ultra 60 and would
> > like to verify this will work before purchasing an adapter.
>
> > If I understand correctly the 411 has a DB50 female connector and the
> > Ultra has a DB68 female connector and the 411 cable is DB50 male on
> > both ends. As such I'm thinking a DB50(female) to DB68 (male) adapter
>
> Hmm ... those connector names are wrong -- but there are people
> calling almost any connector computer related "DB" -- even though they
> aren't. The "DB" gives the shell size of the D style connector with
> round pins. DB-25 in particular. Other pin counts in other shell sizes
> have other second letters -- the DD-50 for example.
>
> However -- these connectors are a totally different series, not
> the 'D' series at all. The 50-pin connector is often called just the
> "SCSI-II connector", though I think that is wrong, too. :-) What you are
> looking at are the "HD-50" and HD-68" connectors.
Thanks, yes - that was a mistake on my part.
> However -- the Ultra-60's 68-pin connector on the back connects
> to no drives inside the box. It is a totally separate SCSI bus from the
> one used inside the box for the two disk drives and the CD-ROM drive.
>
> So -- as long as what you are connecting to it is only a 50-pin
> device (or even a chain of them) you don't need to worry about the high
> byte. Just get a 68-pin to 50-pin SCSI cable.
Thanks for verifying that - that was more or less my understanding
after doing more research yesterday. The cable I bought (should be
here tomorrow) is a standard HD68 to HD50 cable. I figured if it
didn't work I was only out 14 dollars so not a big deal.
> A quick eBay search finds auction 230199136497 as the first
> offering such a cable. This one is a 12-foot one, and you probably want
> a shorter one. Auction 120190305633 contains a 3-foot one which is
> probably a better bet.
>
> No idea what the vendors
> are like. Avoid any which call themselves "VHDCI 68 pin" as those won't
> fit the connector which you have.
>
> > And finally - Some adapters are listed as HPDB50 or DPDB68 - is this
> > the same as the DB50 or DB68?
>
> No idea -- since the DB50 and DB68 are undefined and may be
> totally unsuitable anyway. The first thing I found searching on:
>
> SCSI cable DB50
>
> is actually the D*D*50 -- a very old SCSI cable used in the Sun-3
> machines. Anything later uses the HD-50 or HD-68 -- or on PCI cards,
> the VHDCI-68.
I've seen some sites that refer to the HPDB as "half pitch" - not sure
what that's supposed to mean but it looks like the pictures of all the
HD connectors. Here's a site from a random google search using the
half pitch terminology:
> > Thanks for your input - for some reason I find the various SCSI
> > terminology confusing.
>
> It is made worse by the incorrect nomenclature used by the eBay
> vendors.
>
> BTW -- when you get some 68-pin devices to add to your
> collection, make your 50-pin the last thing in the chain. If you put it
> in the middle of the chain, you will confuse the system with later
> devices saying "I'm a wide device" through the 50 pin connector, after
> which the system will try to talk to it wide, and fail, and you'll have
> lots of retires before it falls back to narrow.
>
> And drives which are 68-pin or 80-pin (like the SCA drives
> inside the system box) will be *much* faster than the 50-pin devices, so
> you will proably want to move to the wider devices as soon as possible.
> (also -- you can get much more capacity in the 68-pin drives than in the
> 50-pin drives. I think that my largest 50-pin drive is only 4GB, and
> I've got 68-pin drives up to 50 GB, and I know that even larger are
> available.
I've got an 18.2G SCA drive on the way - the first one I bought was
bad. The 411 works great with my SparcServer20 - I'm not sure I'll use
it on the Ultra 60 all the time but I did want to see if I could hook
it up and install an OS - at least until I can get a functioning
internal drive. Sadly the Ultra 60 doesn't have a extra plug on the
back like the SS20 so it's not quite as handy to have an external
device attached to it.
Speaking of drives - I've had great luck getting older Unix/Sun gear
from ebay - the recent hard drive was the first thing I've ever bought
that didn't work, but I'm wondering if there is a reputable site that
sells used hard drives at a *reasonable* price? I wouldn't mind paying
a few more bucks if it means not having to roll the ebay dice for some
things.
SCSI adapter question 
The site I referenced appears to have a pretty good
Linear Mode
