Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
electricity rates here locally today.
Having said that..... what could a person do to either
buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
Uses would be for typical Internet stuff as well as
word processing, maybe voice recognition software even.
What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
energy?
And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
low power?
Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
there?
<me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:a051s3t4m8rlel2rue880i06jg2h0h8f3g@4ax.com...
> Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
> electricity rates here locally today.
>
> Having said that..... what could a person do to either
> buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
> that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
>
> Uses would be for typical Internet stuff as well as
> word processing, maybe voice recognition software even.
>
> What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
> power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
> used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
> box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
> energy?
No. The 500W power supply is likely only good for 300W max, and will rarely
go over 200W, assuming dismal efficiency numbers.
>
> And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
> server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
> and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
> low power?
>
> Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
> there?
<me@privacy.net> wrote in message
news:1671s39tvu1a61puuhj148vjpnkb0cs2t5@4ax.com...
> "Dave" <noway@nohow.not> wrote:
>
>>> there?
>>
>>http://www.walmart.com/catalog/produ...uct_id=8054241
>>Should use about 50W max when recording, less than 5W when not. -Dave
>
> Yeah could buy a dedicate device like above.... but no
> connectivity with anything else tho!
What do you want to connect it to? I can connect my DVRs (two of them, both
dedicated boxes) to my PC, my PC *MONITOR*, my A/V receiver, my HDTV
monitor, my DVD changer, my satellite tuner, a cable tuner if I had one, my
VCR if I still had one...
I can't imagine what you'd want to connect a DVR to that couldn't be done.
I mean, it won't connect real easily with my refrigerator, but that doesn't
upset me too much. -Dave
You should just make sure the PC / motherboard supports S3 standby, and set
the PC to go into standby after, say, 10 minutes of inactivity.
Any HTPC software will wake the PC to record, update EPG etc.but when in S3
standby the PC is off, apart from a tiny amount of power to keep the memory
intact. This is about as green as you can get with any PC, with no loss of
functionality at all. In fact the best thing about S3 is the speed to 'boot'
windows and begin using the PC is a fraction of the time it takes for a full
power-on.
<me@privacy.net> wrote...
> Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
> electricity rates here locally today.
>
> Having said that..... what could a person do to either
> buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
> that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
If you're building one, check your motherboard and CPU choices for their power
draw. For example, AMD X2 CPUs can draw from 65 to 125 watts
(http://products.amd.com/en-us/Deskto...=&f8=&f9=2000&),
and power consumption is NOT necessarily related to speed or CPU
"power"/capability.
Similarly, the latest Intel Core2 Duo/Quad CPUs are rated at 65 watts max.
Combine the low-power CPU with an energy-efficient motherboard like the Gigabyte
"Dynamic Energy Saver" line for example
(http://www.giga-byte.com/FileList/We...des-models.htm),
and you can get the system (computer "box" AND peripherals) power down to 120
watts or so (my GA-P35-DS4, Intel E6850, WD Raptor, 2 GB) with the monitor in
standby and the CPU running at full capacity.
> What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
> power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
> used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
> box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
> energy?
The Power Supply only draws what the computer demands, plus its overhead and
thermal efficiency losses.
Again, look for an efficient power supply with "80Plus" certification like the
Antec Earthwatts series (http://www.antec.com/us/pro_p_EarthWatts.php). PSUs
are most efficient around 20-60% of rated load, and "80Plus" expands that to a
minimum efficiency of 80% from 20-100%. The Earthwatts 380 will power just
about any "energy efficient" system you would build, and the 500 will handle
more powerful graphics cards.
That brings up another potential power hog: the graphics card. You don't need
the latest and greatest gfx card for reasonable performance; it may draw 75-100
watts on its own! Get a reasonable GPU (e.g., ATI 1650 or 1950 series) if you
need it to watch your HD movies on a big LCD.
That LCD may be a power hog, too... However, dimming the brightness can save
significant power (e.g., from 100 to 40 watts on my Samsung 244T). Check the
specs for active and standby power, so it doesn't use a bunch when sleeping.
Also, disable screensavers -- they use power even if they're "dark"!
> And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
> server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
> and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
> low power?
>
> Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
> there?
Take your pick. If you build, you'll have a better idea of what you have.
However, at the lower end you may find is significantly cheaper to buy one...
me@privacy.net wrote in news:a051s3t4m8rlel2rue880i06jg2h0h8f3g@4ax.com:
> Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
> electricity rates here locally today.
>
> Having said that..... what could a person do to either
> buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
> that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
>
> Uses would be for typical Internet stuff as well as
> word processing, maybe voice recognition software even.
>
> What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
> power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
> used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
> box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
> energy?
>
> And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
> server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
> and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
> low power?
>
> Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
> there?
On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 16:56:27 -0800, "John Weiss"
<jrweiss98155NOSPAM@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote:
><me@privacy.net> wrote...
>> Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
>> electricity rates here locally today.
>>
>> Having said that..... what could a person do to either
>> buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
>> that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
>
>If you're buying one, look for EnergyStar certification
>(http://www.energystar.gov/index.cfm?...crit_computers for a summary
>of criteria). Also look for total amperage on the system.
>
>If you're building one, check your motherboard and CPU choices for their power
>draw. For example, AMD X2 CPUs can draw from 65 to 125 watts
>(http://products.amd.com/en-us/Deskto...=&f8=&f9=2000&),
>and power consumption is NOT necessarily related to speed or CPU
>"power"/capability.
>
>Similarly, the latest Intel Core2 Duo/Quad CPUs are rated at 65 watts max.
I would have to agree with John here.
I have the E6850 Core 2 Duo, it is more the capable of handling
everything you mentioned and more. I can now convert a 649mb AVI file
into DVD format in 25min whereas the old P4 3GHz setup I had used to
take hours to do the same thing.
>
>Combine the low-power CPU with an energy-efficient motherboard like the Gigabyte
>"Dynamic Energy Saver" line for example
>(http://www.giga-byte.com/FileList/We...des-models.htm),
>and you can get the system (computer "box" AND peripherals) power down to 120
>watts or so (my GA-P35-DS4, Intel E6850, WD Raptor, 2 GB) with the monitor in
>standby and the CPU running at full capacity.
John gets no argument from me here either.
>
>> What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
>> power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
>> used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
>> box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
>> energy?
>
>The Power Supply only draws what the computer demands, plus its overhead and
>thermal efficiency losses.
>
>Again, look for an efficient power supply with "80Plus" certification like the
>Antec Earthwatts series (http://www.antec.com/us/pro_p_EarthWatts.php). PSUs
>are most efficient around 20-60% of rated load, and "80Plus" expands that to a
>minimum efficiency of 80% from 20-100%. The Earthwatts 380 will power just
>about any "energy efficient" system you would build, and the 500 will handle
>more powerful graphics cards.
I also purchased the Earthwatts 500 PSU and had no issues with it.
A rule I work with, a cheap price goes hand in hand with cheap
components or workmanship, things are usually in the bargain basket
for a reason.
>
>That brings up another potential power hog: the graphics card. You don't need
>the latest and greatest gfx card for reasonable performance; it may draw 75-100
>watts on its own! Get a reasonable GPU (e.g., ATI 1650 or 1950 series) if you
>need it to watch your HD movies on a big LCD.
If you have no need for high end graphic cards, then save your cash
for getting better components you do need.
I purchased the Asus EN8500GT with 512mb ram, I have been told that
the card is rubbish, but it does all that I want, it gives me Ultra
Quality graphics in Doom 3 at 1024x768. I am happy with it, it is
passive cooled so no fan means lower power usage and 0db noise, I have
read that a better economy card is the 8600 series by nVidea, it is
said to run cooler and use less power. (Google that for your self)
>
>That LCD may be a power hog, too... However, dimming the brightness can save
>significant power (e.g., from 100 to 40 watts on my Samsung 244T). Check the
>specs for active and standby power, so it doesn't use a bunch when sleeping.
>Also, disable screensavers -- they use power even if they're "dark"!
As it was said earlier, check the spec's, the bigger the screen, the
finer the resolution the more whistles and bells an item has the more
power it will need to please you. My BENQ FP767 is rated operational
50watts & standby 3watts.
>
>> And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
>> server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
>> and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
>> low power?
You still do not need a high end computer to do this.
>>
>> Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
>> there?
I tend to not like these build to a budget machines, but that is just
how I feel, a bit like you get what you pay for.
>
>Take your pick. If you build, you'll have a better idea of what you have.
>However, at the lower end you may find is significantly cheaper to buy one...
>
I was talking to my brother today, and he said it was easy to have a
Green Computer, just go to the shop and get a can of Green paint, it
comes in many shades.
And that is about the level of his computer knowledge.
My Setup
Antec Earthwatts 500watt Power Supply
Gigabyte GA-P35-DS3P SLI (rev 2.0)
Intel® Core™2 Duo E6850 3.00GHz/4M/1333
CORSAIR TWIN2X1024-6400C4 (CM2X1024-6400C4)
ASUS EN8500GT SILENT-HTP-512M (GeForce 8500GT 512mb)
2x SAMSUNG 160gb SATA-2 8meg Cache 7200rpm Model SP161HJ
ASUS DRW-1814BLT-SATA DVD(±R/±RW/±R DL) Cd(±R/±RW)
On Sat, 23 Feb 2008 15:45:50 -0600, me@privacy.net wrote:
>Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
>electricity rates here locally today.
>
>Having said that..... what could a person do to either
>buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
>that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
>
>Uses would be for typical Internet stuff as well as
>word processing, maybe voice recognition software even.
>
>What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
>power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
>used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
>box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
>energy?
>
>And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
>server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
>and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
>low power?
>
>Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
>there?
This is the contents of my Antec Solutions SLK3700AMD Super Mid Tower.
Antec Earthwatts 500watt Power Supply (EA-500)
Enermax 120mm Variable Speed case fan (Intake)
Enermax 120mm Variable Speed case fan (Exhaust)
GIGABYTE - GA-P35-DS3P (rev 2.0)"
Intel® Core™2 Duo E6850 3.00GHz/4MB/1333FSB/LGA775
Intel Stock Heatsink & Fan
CORSAIR TWIN2X1024-6400C4 (CM2X1024-6400C4)
ASUS EN8500GT SILENT-HTP-512M (GeForce 8500GT 512mb)
5 Port High Speed USB 2.0 PCI Card
Creative Sound Blaster Audigy 2 ZS
SAMSUNG 160gb SATA-2 8meg Cache 7200rpm Model SP161HJ C:
SAMSUNG 160gb SATA-2 8meg Cache 7200rpm Model SP161HJ D:
ASUS DRW-1814BLT-SATA DVD(±R/±RW/±R DL) Cd(±R/±RW)
Panasonic 1.44mb
BenQ FP767 - 17" LCD Monitor
All this is kept running in the event of a blackout by my
650VA-360watt Belkin UPS.
You were asking if you had a 500watt power supply, are you using the
entire 500watts even to power a low wattage system, as you can see, I
have a 500watt PSU along with all the rest, all happy to work off a
360watt battery backup. And I have a CanoScan Lide 20 A4 Scanner
powered by a usb port on standby + keyboard & mouse.
me@privacy.net wrote:
> Well they announced a 40 percent increase in local
> electricity rates here locally today.
>
> Having said that..... what could a person do to either
> buy or build a "green" low energy use PC? Something
> that one would not be afraid to leave on 24/7?
>
> Uses would be for typical Internet stuff as well as
> word processing, maybe voice recognition software even.
>
> What make a PC a power hog anyway? If you have a big
> power supply say 500 watts.... but it is only being
> used to power say 200 watts worth of equipment in the
> box ...does that mean the PC is STIL using 500 watts
> energy?
>
> And what could a person do if wanting to build a home
> server type machine where it would in fact be on 24/7
> and recording TV programs off air, etc? How to keep it
> low power?
>
> Or.... can I just BUY something already low power out
> there?
The first thing to do, would be to work out what it
costs to run a device, 24/7. But to do that, you need
to know exactly what it is using.
To start, purchase a Kill-a-Watt meter. This will allow
you to measure the actual system consumption. You can go
around the house, and monitor other things, as well as
your computer.
I have one additional trick. I have a clamp-on ammeter, and
have used that to measure larger devices in the house. One
power loss I discovered in my house, was my central air
conditioner wasting ~70W for an internal heater. Now I
open the breaker when the summer is finished. For years,
during the winter, that **** thing was wasting electricity.
You'd be surprised what some devices do behind your back.
I discovered this, when doing maintenance
on the central air.
A 500W ATX supply doesn't draw 500W. It has a 500W total output
limit. If the computer draws 100W, the supply delivers 100W.
So the computer components are the determining factor, not
the size of the supply.
Say the computer uses $100 of electricity per year. Then,
if you replaced the box with a new design, how many years
would it take for the electrical savings, to pay back the
capital cost ? Remembering, that the new box also uses
electricity, so we're talking about the difference between the
new and old box, in electrical usage.
To make a recording device, that uses minimal electricity -
1) Capture device or information source, already in a
compressed mode. In other words, for the computer part
of recording, you want the processor to not have to
do anything to the data, but write it to disk. If
you can achieve that, you could then use a Conroe-L 35W
processor, which is a single core. For example, some
capture cards record in some MPEG format, so the data is
already compressed.
2) Storage devices. A 3 1/2" drive runs constantly and
power use varies a bit from product to product. For
power calcs, I assume 5V @ 1A, and 12V @ 0.6A, but you
can usually look up a drive and get a more recent number.
2.5" laptop drives use about 5V @ 500mA or less. They
may also operate incrementally, spinning down when not
being used. For recording applications, you'd save power,
but I don't know how long a laptop drive would last, if
it is constantly spinning down and spinning up again.
SSD drives based on flash, can have power usage less than
those figures. But they also cost a lot of money, to get
a large drive. If using an SSD for the task, you'd want to
wake another system a few times a day, and "dump" recordings
to a HDD based computer of some sort.
3) Computers come with Cool N' Quiet or with EIST. Those are
schemes, where the core speed and core voltage, are adjusted
to meet the computing load. That helps keep the power low.
There are even lower power states, but it would be pretty
hard to tell if you were achieving them, unless you have
your Kill-a-Watt handy. Lower power states are only possible,
if the computer isn't doing anything.
4) Power supply choice. The cheapest power supplies have an internal
efficiency of 68%. A good supply may manage 85%. The efficiency
depends on the loading as well, so the 85% supply doesn't give
85% at low load. But certainly the 85% supply will help trim
the wastage. Good 85% efficient supplies might range around $100.
Cheap 68% supplies might cost $20. You get what you pay for.
Going to this much trouble, usually pays off for applications
which are "off the grid". If you use batteries, have solar, or
wind power, or water power, then every watt counts. It may then be
worthwhile wasting thousands, to develop just the right solution
for your application. But when the grid is present, the
payback might take a while. Especially when you consider the
number of hours you spent building and researching just the
right solution.
Say you install a 4GHz processor in a computer. Then you write
a piece of C code, that polls a device on the bus. The CPU spins
in a loop, and ends up running at full power. Instantly,
with your Kill-a-Watt meter, you see the computer drawing 100W
more electricity. If the program was more carefully written, to
be triggered by hardware interrupts, the power drops down quite
a bit. For example, my processor only draws 13.2W measured, when
sitting idle in Linux or Win2K, due to the Idle loop using the
HLT (halt) instruction. If the HLT instruction is not used, the
power jumps up to like 50W or so. The Kill-a-Watt meter makes
it easy to monitor for stuff like that. At least you can keep
track of the progress you're making. For example, you can
boot a Linux LiveCD, like Ubuntu or Knoppix, measure the computer
power with the Kill-a-Watt. Then, boot into Windows. If you
haven't buggered your Windows install, Windows can match the
power performance of Linux. I get the same processor power
consumption for all of those OS options. When my antivirus
software is installed in Windows, that is when Windows becomes
more of a pig. So even innocent looking software additions,
can upset your power saving plans.
But you'll learn more about this, the more that you use your
new Kill-a-Watt.
My area is getting "time of day" billing. My power meter has
already been replaced with a digital meter. All the meters
have wireless transmission, but the wireless part isn't running
yet. Some day, the power usage every 15 minutes, will be reported
to the power company, via the "pico net" concept. And I'll be billed
a different fee, between 8AM and 5PM, than the rest of the
day. At that point, the central air will be running all night,
and switched off during the day. By 5PM, I'll be good and
sweaty, thanks to the coming new policy. Welcome to the
future.
Question: What make a "green" low energy PC? 
-Dave
Linear Mode
