John Weiss wrote:
> "Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM@myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote...
>> I'm ready to purchase a new PC. I'm not sure yet if I should buy
>> something preconfigured or build my own. I want it to be powerful and
>> fast, but I don't believe I will have any requirements for 3-D
>> graphics
>> as I am not a gamer. I'm pretty sure I will want to do both audio
>> (electronic music recording, editing, and mixing) and video editing,
>> so
>> I know RAM is important. What other specs should I be concerned with?
>> Especially, what is the best kind of CPU? Does the type of CPU
>> required depend on particular software I may run (I'm not sure yet
>> which audio
>> and video editing software I plan on using)? Also, any
>> recommendations
>> for graphics and sound cards would be appreciated.
>
> In general, the Intel Core2Duo/Quad and AMD X2 CPU are your top
> choices. Which you choose is a matter of personal brand preference
> and price/performance. Intel has the performance nod at the top end,
> but AMD may have the edge in price/performance in the middle.
>
> You only "need" a quad core CPU if the software you run can take
> advantage of more than 2 cores or if you participate in a distributed
> computing project like Folding@Home (http://folding.stanford.edu).
> Otherwise, a higher clock speed dual-core will serve you better for
> most apps at the same price as a lower clock speed quad.
>
> For 32-bit OSes like Win XP, 3 GB RAM is the most they can address,
> and few people can effectively use more than 2 GB. The 64-bit
> versions of Windows still have significant deficiencies in driver and
> application availability.
>
> For reasonably priced gfx, an ATI X1950 Pro card with 512 MB VRAM
> will handle just about anything you need.
>
> I just built one with a Gigabyte mobo, P35 chipset, C2D E6850 CPU, 2
> GB Crucial Ballistix RAM, and X1950Pro gfx. You may find some
> advantages with the new X38 chipset for an Intel system, at slightly
> higher cost.
I would like to thank *everybody* for all the helpful replies.
John (or anyone else), I've just started scratching the surface, and as
you might imagine, I keep coming up with more questions! The videoguys
web site Bill recommended had a lot of useful information. I think that
I will tentatively go for an Intel CPU and hold off on sound cards for a
bit; the audio and video production at present is more of a hobby than
anything else, but I'm certainly open to the idea of making money from
it eventually. :-)
So here come the questions...
Can you recommend a good online company where I can configure a
custom-made PC?
Should I stick with a 32-bit system, and if so, would 64-bit
motherboards (e.g., Intel DX38BT) run a 32-bit OS (I don't know if
they're backward-compatible or not)?
I already plan on running XP. Is there any reason to get Pro? Or is XP
Home sufficient?
It seems like 2 GB of RAM should suffice, but I wonder would it be a
better idea to go for 3 GB instead? (I would imagine that anything more
than 3 GB is overkill.) Is there a particular type or brand of RAM I
should get? What about dual-channel and ECC? DDR2 vs. DDR3?
Laugh if you will, but I still want a floppy drive! Do modern
motherboards have floppy controller ports?
Any recommendations for power supplies?
I did some preliminary research at Tiger Direct. I saw a number of Intel
motherboards (are other brands better?). Is there a particular FSB speed
I should try to get? I know this would also determine the type of RAM I
get. Chipsets were G33, P35, and X38. I assume the higher the number,
the better? I don't know much about chipsets... how important is a
southbridge (I noticed only one of the mobos had a southbridge)?
Again, TIA.
P.S., at Tiger Direct, I came up with a PC that would cost $1,269.95
(US):
Systemax Mid-Tower
Intel D975XBX2 ATX motherboard
Intel Core2 Duo E6420 2.13 GHz 4M 1066Mhz CPU
2GB DDR2 PC6400 800 MHz Dual Channel (1GB x 2)
160GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
250GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
20X DVD+R/RW-R/RW Dual Layer Drive
Creative SoundBlaster X-FI Fatality (w/o this, the system would be
$1,069.96)
Radeon X1550 512MB PCI-Express (1DVI / 1VGA) video card (I found it odd
that Tiger Direct doesn't carry the X1950 Pro)
Windows XP Home (generic OEM, I presume... it said "DSP")
500 Watt Power Supply
and One floppy drive :-)
> So here come the questions...
>
> Can you recommend a good online company where I can configure a
> custom-made PC?
I'd suggest starting with a motherboard bundle from www.mwave.com
Selection isn't quite as large as newegg, but mwave tends to carry better
brands (or fewer off-brands at least) at very competitive prices, and their
service is better than neweggs.
> Should I stick with a 32-bit system, and if so, would 64-bit
> motherboards (e.g., Intel DX38BT) run a 32-bit OS (I don't know if
> they're backward-compatible or not)?
I'm dual-booting (well, triple-booting, with linux) 32-bit operating systems
on 64-bit hardware. Long story but, when I bought Vista, I wasn't observant
enough to notice that ONLY the 32-bit version of it was included (along with
instructions for obtaining the 64-bit version). Didn't want to wait weeks
to install the new OS, so I just installed the 32-bit Vista. And I've been
too lazy to update it since. The only thing you need to look out for
is, if you EVER want to run 64-bit software, then all your hardware and your
OS needs to be 64-bit.
>
> I already plan on running XP. Is there any reason to get Pro? Or is XP
> Home sufficient?
> It seems like 2 GB of RAM should suffice, but I wonder would it be a
> better idea to go for 3 GB instead? (I would imagine that anything more
> than 3 GB is overkill.) Is there a particular type or brand of RAM I
> should get? What about dual-channel and ECC? DDR2 vs. DDR3?
More than 2GB will only help if you have a specific application that can use
the extra RAM. Read your video editing software documentation or any
sound-recording/mixing apps. to find out. But in general, it's somewhat
unlikely that you will be able to use more than 2GB of RAM, no matter how
hard you try to do so. If you do dip into RAM above 2GB, it's likely to be
used for video editing. Don't worry about dual-channel (optional, neither
good nor bad), avoid ECC (wasted money), and DDR2/DDR3 makes no difference.
It's good that you asked about brand though. Besides skimping on the power
supply, the number one mistake of many new builders is to go for no-name
RAM. Get a good name brand. I like OCZ and Kingston brands myself, as I've
had no compatibility or stability problems, ever, with those brands. But
there are other good brands also. Find motherboard reviews for your
motherboard, see what brands of RAM that other builders have had good luck
with, when building with your motherboard.
>
> Laugh if you will, but I still want a floppy drive! Do modern
> motherboards have floppy controller ports?
I haven't seen one yet that doesn't have the legacy floppy controller and
appropriate connector. It wouldn't surprise me if this is eventually phased
out though.
>
> Any recommendations for power supplies?
Yes. Go for Seasonic, Enermax or OCZ. And post the specific model here
before you buy. If you buy the wrong power supply, you might as well take a
sledgehammer to the rest of your hardware. It's that important, it can't
possibly be overstated. The power supply is the first half of EVERY
component in your system, so it's easy to turn top-notch hardware into JUNK
by simply choosing the wrong power supply or (worse) using a power supply
that was included with a case. Expect to spend about a hundred bucks (maybe
more) on just the power supply. There are some bargains though. That's why
I said post the specific model here, so the experts can review it.
>
> I did some preliminary research at Tiger Direct. I saw a number of Intel
> motherboards (are other brands better?).
Better than Intel? No. There are some brands that match Intel quality,
while trying to offer different features. Other brands you might consider
are AOpen and Biostar. Note that Asrock, Asus and Gigabyte are all the same
company, and I specifically would not recommend any of those three.
(thought many will disagree with me there)
> Is there a particular FSB speed
> I should try to get?
Not really. Faster is usually better, but the point is moot, as long as the
motherboard supports the CPU you choose. It is highly unlikely that you
will want to upgrade without replacing the motherboard, so FSB is not
something you should need to worry about.
> I know this would also determine the type of RAM I
> get. Chipsets were G33, P35, and X38. I assume the higher the number,
> the better? I don't know much about chipsets... how important is a
> southbridge (I noticed only one of the mobos had a southbridge)?
Higher the better? Nope, shop by motherboard features (especially support
for your chosen CPU). For your build, it looks like P35 would be a good
choice, at the moment. Oh, they all have a southbridge. Some motherboard
chipsets roll this into a single-chip solution, though. That is, the
northbridge also handles the southbridge functions. It is vitally
important, but you aren't going to find a motherboard without one, so don't
worry about it.
>
> Again, TIA.
>
> P.S., at Tiger Direct, I came up with a PC that would cost $1,269.95
> (US):
>
> Systemax Mid-Tower
Personal preference. Probably OK.
> Intel D975XBX2 ATX motherboard
Interesting choice. Should work fine, but I think this model is being
phased out, as it appears to be slightly older technology.
> Intel Core2 Duo E6420 2.13 GHz 4M 1066Mhz CPU
Good.
> 2GB DDR2 PC6400 800 MHz Dual Channel (1GB x 2)
BRAND?!?
> 160GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
> 250GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
> 20X DVD+R/RW-R/RW Dual Layer Drive
If possible, get a recent copy of nero OEM suite with your DVD burner
> Creative SoundBlaster X-FI Fatality (w/o this, the system would be
> $1,069.96)
If you are thinking about audio work, you might want to hold off on buying
the sound card, or go with a cheap one to start with. Creative Labs Sound
Blaster Audigy SE would be a good choice to start with, only 30 bucks.
> Radeon X1550 512MB PCI-Express (1DVI / 1VGA) video card (I found it odd
> that Tiger Direct doesn't carry the X1950 Pro)
If you're not a gamer, this should work fine.
> Windows XP Home (generic OEM, I presume... it said "DSP")
I didn't see DSP on tiger direct. But the OEM version should work fine.
> 500 Watt Power Supply
500 Watt Power supply is minimum I would recommend for your rig, BUT that's
assuming it's a good name brand. I don't like the selection at Tiger
Direct, but the Corsair VX550W would be a good choice, if you have to stick
with tiger direct. -Dave
"Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM@myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote...
>
> Can you recommend a good online company where I can configure a
> custom-made PC?
For one to build yourself, Newegg is probably the best overall. I got all my
parts there except the monitor; MacMall had a better deal there.
> Should I stick with a 32-bit system, and if so, would 64-bit
> motherboards (e.g., Intel DX38BT) run a 32-bit OS (I don't know if
> they're backward-compatible or not)?
32-bit Windows or Ubuntu is still the best choice, for driver and application
compatibility. All the current 64-bit motherboards are backward compatible.
> I already plan on running XP. Is there any reason to get Pro? Or is XP
> Home sufficient?
Stay away from XP Home. Its networking sucks.
> It seems like 2 GB of RAM should suffice, but I wonder would it be a
> better idea to go for 3 GB instead? (I would imagine that anything more
> than 3 GB is overkill.) Is there a particular type or brand of RAM I
> should get? What about dual-channel and ECC? DDR2 vs. DDR3?
2 GB is fine. ECC will be determined by the motherboard; in general only used
by servers and high-end workstations with lots of RAM.
DDR3 not yet worth the extra cost. DDR2 is the standard. I'm partial to
Crucial; Corsair or Kingston are also good choices.
> Laugh if you will, but I still want a floppy drive! Do modern
> motherboards have floppy controller ports?
Some do. Otherwise use USB (internal or external)
..
> Any recommendations for power supplies?
Antec Earthwatts 500.
> I did some preliminary research at Tiger Direct. I saw a number of Intel
> motherboards (are other brands better?). Is there a particular FSB speed
> I should try to get? I know this would also determine the type of RAM I
> get. Chipsets were G33, P35, and X38. I assume the higher the number,
> the better? I don't know much about chipsets... how important is a
> southbridge (I noticed only one of the mobos had a southbridge)?
Look for a motherboard with an Intel P35 or X38 chipset. X38 is newer, hence
more expensive. Both have reasonable upgrade potential.
All have a Southbridge; not all may be identified. The P35 and X38 both use the
Intel ICH9R Southbridge.
> P.S., at Tiger Direct, I came up with a PC that would cost $1,269.95
> (US):
>
> Systemax Mid-Tower
> Intel D975XBX2 ATX motherboard
> Intel Core2 Duo E6420 2.13 GHz 4M 1066Mhz CPU
> 2GB DDR2 PC6400 800 MHz Dual Channel (1GB x 2)
> 160GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
> 250GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
> 20X DVD+R/RW-R/RW Dual Layer Drive
> Creative SoundBlaster X-FI Fatality (w/o this, the system would be
> $1,069.96)
You probably don't need to spend $200 on a sound card. You can get good ones
for half that...
> Radeon X1550 512MB PCI-Express (1DVI / 1VGA) video card (I found it odd
> that Tiger Direct doesn't carry the X1950 Pro)
Try for at least an X1650 Pro.
Tiger may have slightly lower prices, but nowhere near the good reputation
Newegg has.
> Windows XP Home (generic OEM, I presume... it said "DSP")
Dunno what "DSP" menas. An OEM pack will say OEM. Again, stay away from XP
home; Pro is not that much more expensive in OEM pack.
> 500 Watt Power Supply
> and One floppy drive :-)
"John Weiss" <jrweiss98155NOSPAM@NOSPAM.comcast.net> wrote in message
news:t4udna5ULPH2JgnanZ2dnUVZ_gqdnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> "Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM@myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote...
>>
>> Can you recommend a good online company where I can configure a
>> custom-made PC?
>
<SNIP>
>> P.S., at Tiger Direct, I came up with a PC that would cost $1,269.95
>> (US):
>>
>> Systemax Mid-Tower
>> Intel D975XBX2 ATX motherboard
>> Intel Core2 Duo E6420 2.13 GHz 4M 1066Mhz CPU
>> 2GB DDR2 PC6400 800 MHz Dual Channel (1GB x 2)
>> 160GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
>> 250GB 7200RPM 3G SATA II Hard Drive
>> 20X DVD+R/RW-R/RW Dual Layer Drive
>> Creative SoundBlaster X-FI Fatality (w/o this, the system would be
>> $1,069.96)
>
> You probably don't need to spend $200 on a sound card. You can get good
> ones for half that...
>
>
>> Radeon X1550 512MB PCI-Express (1DVI / 1VGA) video card (I found it odd
>> that Tiger Direct doesn't carry the X1950 Pro)
>
> Try for at least an X1650 Pro.
FWIW, buy.com has the Diamond Viper Radeon X1650Pro PCI Express x16 - 512MB
(2DVI, with 1 DVI to VGA adapter) for $35.99 shipped after $20 rebate.
"Fred" <bluser@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:5vctnjF1lp3maU1@mid.individual.net...
> Also the new instruction set SSE4.1, that Intel introduced with the
> new Penryn processors, looks promising for future releases of video
> software optimized for them.
I was doing a little research on this. The E8500 (now referred to
Wolfdale, I believe) looks like a contender, but apparently the first
batch sold out real fast! I know no one has a crystal ball, but
typically how much longer might it take until it is available again? And
if I want to build a barebones system which already has this processor
on a compatible motherboard, when will I start seeing them available for
sale?
If we're talking several months, I might just go ahead with the E6850.
Or does the difference in performance justify the wait?
"Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM@myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote...
>
> I was doing a little research on this. The E8500 (now referred to Wolfdale, I
> believe) looks like a contender, but apparently the first batch sold out real
> fast! I know no one has a crystal ball, but typically how much longer might it
> take until it is available again? And if I want to build a barebones system
> which already has this processor on a compatible motherboard, when will I
> start seeing them available for sale?
>
> If we're talking several months, I might just go ahead with the E6850. Or does
> the difference in performance justify the wait?
I don't think the performance justifies the wait or the price. The new SSE4
instructions have not yet been adopted by software developers, so it will take
more time and $$ for software upgrades to take advantage of them.
For full upgradability options, spend the extra $30 for an X38 chipset instead
of P35 (e.g., Gigabyte has both offerings in its DS4 or DQ6 series), and wait
until the price of the next-gen CPUs comes down.
John Weiss wrote:
> "Daave" <dcwashNOSPAM@myrealboxXYZ.invalid> wrote...
>>
>> I was doing a little research on this. The E8500 (now referred to
>> Wolfdale, I believe) looks like a contender, but apparently the
>> first batch sold out real fast! I know no one has a crystal ball,
>> but typically how much longer might it take until it is available
>> again? And if I want to build a barebones system which already has
>> this processor on a compatible motherboard, when will I start seeing
>> them available for sale?
>>
>> If we're talking several months, I might just go ahead with the
>> E6850. Or does the difference in performance justify the wait?
>
> I don't think the performance justifies the wait or the price. The
> new SSE4 instructions have not yet been adopted by software
> developers, so it will take more time and $$ for software upgrades to
> take advantage of them.
>
> For full upgradability options, spend the extra $30 for an X38
> chipset instead of P35 (e.g., Gigabyte has both offerings in its DS4
> or DQ6 series), and wait until the price of the next-gen CPUs comes
> down.
>> Is there a particular FSB speed
>> I should try to get?
>
> Not really. Faster is usually better, but the point is moot, as long
> as the motherboard supports the CPU you choose. It is highly
> unlikely that you will want to upgrade without replacing the
> motherboard, so FSB is not something you should need to
> worry about.
That's interesting. I thought it was a concern because it also
determines how fast the RAM can be. For instance, if I were to go with
Kingston memory, I see choices all over the place -- from 2 sticks of
533 MHz RAM (2 GB total) for $43.00 up to 2 sticks of 1066 MHz RAM (2 GB
total) for $124. I also encountered "high performance" Kingston RAM (a 2
GB kit again) costing as much as $434.75, so I am quite confused!
Bottom line: What exactly is "high performance" and is it worth the
considerably extra premium? And even if I were to avoid high-performance
RAM, how much of a performance difference is there between 533 MHz and
1066 MHz?
>> I know this would also determine the type of RAM I
>> get. Chipsets were G33, P35, and X38. I assume the higher the number,
>> the better? I don't know much about chipsets... how important is a
>> southbridge (I noticed only one of the mobos had a southbridge)?
>
> Higher the better? Nope, shop by motherboard features (especially
> support for your chosen CPU). For your build, it looks like P35
> would be a good choice, at the moment.
Actually, that build was a preliminary one, a result of configuring a
system at Tiger Direct, which by now, seems like a limited choice! It
seems the consensus here so far is to choose an X38 chipset. What's your
take?
Finally, you had also stated:
> Note that Asrock, Asus and Gigabyte are all the same company,
> and I specifically would not recommend any of those three. (thought
> many will disagree with me there)
Again, interesting as the consensus is different. Can you recommend a
site where I can compare? Or is this just based on personal experience?
> That's interesting. I thought it was a concern because it also
> determines how fast the RAM can be. For instance, if I were to go with
> Kingston memory, I see choices all over the place -- from 2 sticks of
> 533 MHz RAM (2 GB total) for $43.00 up to 2 sticks of 1066 MHz RAM (2 GB
> total) for $124. I also encountered "high performance" Kingston RAM (a 2
> GB kit again) costing as much as $434.75, so I am quite confused!
For a high-speed C2D or C2Q motherboard, you will likely have an 800, 1066, or
1333 MHz FSB. You should buy the fastest RAM the MoBo supports to get best
performance and support upgradability. This will likely mean DDR2 1066/800/667
RAM, depending on the MoBo. Some newer P35 and X38 MoBo's use or support DDR3
RAM, but this is not yet cost effective.
I went with Crucial Ballistix BL2KIT12864AA1065 R ($155 at Newegg) for my
Gigabyte P35-DS4.
> Bottom line: What exactly is "high performance" and is it worth the
> considerably extra premium? And even if I were to avoid high-performance
> RAM, how much of a performance difference is there between 533 MHz and
> 1066 MHz?
533 MHz RAM is likely not DDR2, and will not be suitable for a fast C2D (again
depending on the MoBo). Go with DDR2 if possible.
You need not go with the highest-cost RAM, but go with the mainstream or premium
line (not "value" line) of a reputable mfgr like Crucial, Kingston, or Corsair.
premium lines will be more suitable for overclocking, and may run cooler at
standard specs in a "warmer" case.
> Actually, that build was a preliminary one, a result of configuring a
> system at Tiger Direct, which by now, seems like a limited choice! It
> seems the consensus here so far is to choose an X38 chipset. What's your
> take?
Depends on price vs long-term upgradability. The P35 is perfectly adequate if
you don't need 2 full-speed PCIe 16x ports.
>> Note that Asrock, Asus and Gigabyte are all the same company,
>> and I specifically would not recommend any of those three. (thought
>> many will disagree with me there)
>
> Again, interesting as the consensus is different. Can you recommend a
> site where I can compare? Or is this just based on personal experience?
I have heard elsewhere that Asrock and Asus were from the same company, but I
hadn't heard that Gigabyte was related to Asus. Their corporate web sites in
Taiwan are separate and VERY different. I suppose it is possible they might
come under the same corporate umbrella (is a Jaguar or a Volvo "the same" as a
Ford?), but see nothing to indicate they are "the same"...
Re: Looking for Recommendations for my next PC 
The only thing you need to look out for 
Linear Mode
