"CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
news:Cg49m.13938$qx1.9990@newsfe04.iad...
>
> "jmc" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:ee282$4a63a83c$d1fb97d2$31060@gru.com...
>> Pierre wrote:
>>> Thanks for the reply but as far as I can see, Premiere
>>> Elements
>>> doesn't offer the means to select from DVD by titles / tracks
>>> etc.
>>> This, I can do with the likes of DVDFab. If I want to, I can
>>> successfully convert all the Vob files with "TMPG
>>> Enc.Express" or
>>> "VideoReDo" like you suggested and now I've tried.
>>> What I'm really after is an answer as to what causes there to
>>> be a
>>> glitch between two extracted Vob files sliced together on the
>>> timeline... and possibly how to remedy this, as I would
>>> prefer to edit
>>> straight from the Vob files and then re author or 'save as'
>>> from
>>> there.
>>>
>>> Pierre
>>
>> My experience with VideoRedo and Nero Recode....
>> When adding more then one video file they ask if I want to
>> "combine or join" the files.
>>
>> "combine" leaves no glitch.
>>
>> "join" leaves a glitch.
>>
>> I have no idea what the actual difference is or why one would
>> want to
>> "join" the files instead of "combine".
>>
>> jmc
>> (I've also had some files function fine on the computer but
>> once
>> put on dvd and played on a stand alone player they "glitch".
>> Think that may have been before i discovered "combine")
>>
>
> According to VRD+ help, combine is an input fuction that merges
> files at the frame level. Join is an output function which
> expects each "file" to begin on a GOP boundary (i-frame). Files
> which do not begin on an i-frame will have all frames preceding
> the i-frame dropped.
>
True enough, but if you have the VRD TVSuite version and
use the DVD functions to extract by title/track you shouldn't
see that problem.
If you want to use the join function, you should first use
VRD to create new .mpg files and join them. They will
start with an I-frame.
> The confusion comes about because the open function, clearly an
> input fuction, has the option to join or combine files. The
> Join list (menu option), is more obviously an output function
> when editing - and there is no combine function available for
> edited output.
>
> So, dropping semantics, joined files will be concatenated
> without including any p/b frames preceding the first i frame.
> Combined files will include all frames from all files.
>
> There is also an obvious caution in the help screens. Files of
> different sources should not be combined, lest preceding p/b
> frames be used in error in reference to trailing i/p/b frames.
>
> I use VRD+'s join function quite often, to insert extra black
> GOPs into HDTV captures where they've been edited for little or
> no black between show and commercial and there is also a scene
> change at the point in question. Obviously the dropped p/b
> frame issue woud go un-noticed during playback in this case.
>
>
>
>
> DVDdecrypter might be worth a try especially if you use it to join all
> the VOB's into one file, that should eliminate any end of file errors.
>
> Very general guide to this.
> Set DVDdecrypter to file mode.
> Go to the tools menu -> settings -> IFO Mode Tab, then in options set
> file splitting to none.
>
> --
> rich
Thanks again Rich
This solution will do fine, many thanks.
You have to choose 'File Splitting' to 'None' under the File Mode Tab
also.
"Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:HM2dnbpqqKChrvjXnZ2dnUVZ_vSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>
> "CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
> news:Cg49m.13938$qx1.9990@newsfe04.iad...
>>
>> "jmc" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
>> news:ee282$4a63a83c$d1fb97d2$31060@gru.com...
>>> Pierre wrote:
>>>> Thanks for the reply but as far as I can see, Premiere
>>>> Elements
>>>> doesn't offer the means to select from DVD by titles /
>>>> tracks
>>>> etc.
>>>> This, I can do with the likes of DVDFab. If I want to, I
>>>> can
>>>> successfully convert all the Vob files with "TMPG
>>>> Enc.Express" or
>>>> "VideoReDo" like you suggested and now I've tried.
>>>> What I'm really after is an answer as to what causes there
>>>> to
>>>> be a
>>>> glitch between two extracted Vob files sliced together on
>>>> the
>>>> timeline... and possibly how to remedy this, as I would
>>>> prefer to edit
>>>> straight from the Vob files and then re author or 'save as'
>>>> from
>>>> there.
>>>>
>>>> Pierre
>>>
>>> My experience with VideoRedo and Nero Recode....
>>> When adding more then one video file they ask if I want to
>>> "combine or join" the files.
>>>
>>> "combine" leaves no glitch.
>>>
>>> "join" leaves a glitch.
>>>
>>> I have no idea what the actual difference is or why one
>>> would
>>> want to
>>> "join" the files instead of "combine".
>>>
>>> jmc
>>> (I've also had some files function fine on the computer but
>>> once
>>> put on dvd and played on a stand alone player they "glitch".
>>> Think that may have been before i discovered "combine")
>>>
>>
>> According to VRD+ help, combine is an input fuction that
>> merges
>> files at the frame level. Join is an output function which
>> expects each "file" to begin on a GOP boundary (i-frame).
>> Files
>> which do not begin on an i-frame will have all frames
>> preceding
>> the i-frame dropped.
>>
>
> True enough, but if you have the VRD TVSuite version and
> use the DVD functions to extract by title/track you shouldn't
> see that problem.
>
There is no problem to be seen in VRD+ regarding this matter.
Simply choose "auto combine," and "combine" in the Enhanced
Plus Features.
> If you want to use the join function, you should first use
> VRD to create new .mpg files and join them. They will
> start with an I-frame.
>
Gibberish! Works perfectly as stated above. Why would one
*want" to use join, when combine is the documented solution to
retaining all frames from a multi-file VTS or split capture?
How does this help jmc, who said: he has no idea why one way
works and the other does not. Was there something wrong with
the answer given? - taken directly from the VRD+ help screens.
>> The confusion comes about because the open function, clearly
>> an
>> input fuction, has the option to join or combine files. The
>> Join list (menu option), is more obviously an output function
>> when editing - and there is no combine function available for
>> edited output.
>>
>> So, dropping semantics, joined files will be concatenated
>> without including any p/b frames preceding the first i frame.
>> Combined files will include all frames from all files.
>>
>> There is also an obvious caution in the help screens. Files
>> of
>> different sources should not be combined, lest preceding p/b
>> frames be used in error in reference to trailing i/p/b
>> frames.
>>
>> I use VRD+'s join function quite often, to insert extra black
>> GOPs into HDTV captures where they've been edited for little
>> or
>> no black between show and commercial and there is also a
>> scene
>> change at the point in question. Obviously the dropped p/b
>> frame issue woud go un-noticed during playback in this case.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
"CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
news:tel9m.15400$8B7.2688@newsfe20.iad...
>
> "Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:HM2dnbpqqKChrvjXnZ2dnUVZ_vSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>
>> True enough, but if you have the VRD TVSuite version and
>> use the DVD functions to extract by title/track you shouldn't
>> see that problem.
>>
>
> There is no problem to be seen in VRD+ regarding this matter. Simply
> choose "auto combine," and "combine" in the Enhanced Plus Features.
>
The "problem" under discussion was a glitch that the OP
noted when joining files on the timeline of his NLE. Your
suggestion (using the "Plus" version of VRD) implied that
the Join function couldn't be used to solve the problem,
and you provided your description of how it works.
>> If you want to use the join function, you should first use
>> VRD to create new .mpg files and join them. They will
>> start with an I-frame.
>>
>
> Gibberish! Works perfectly as stated above. Why would one *want" to use
> join, when combine is the documented solution to retaining all frames from
> a multi-file VTS or split capture?
>
No one said that "Combine" would not work.
There are a number of reasons for choosing "Join" over
"Combine".
As the choice appears when dragging & dropping a
number of files; the files need to be in the order you want
them, in the combined file. Depending on how the files
were selected, they may or may not be in the order you
want. With "Combine" you will not have a chance to
change the order or add and remove files, before the
combined file is made. With "Join" you can make such
adjustments.
The "Join" function is typically used where VRD
edits or trims a number of related files prior to joining
them together. Cutting out and joining clips from
compatible sources is the major use of a "Cut & Join"
editing program like VRD.
VRD applies a number of "fixes, repairs, optimizations"
to the MPEG files it processes, by running the files through
VRD before joining them, all the files will be in a similar
condition, in that regard. ( And as I mentioned would allow
the "Join" function to also address the OP's problem.)
> How does this help jmc, who said: he has no idea why one way works and the
> other does not. Was there something wrong with the answer given? - taken
> directly from the VRD+ help screens.
>
It would only help if he were to want to use VRD to
"Join" or "Combine" files. To extract a title properly
from a DVD, he should use a program with the correct
process of extraction. One that makes use of the IFO
data and allows for the selection of the individual streams
to be extracted - such as the VRD TVSuite version I
mentioned.
"Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:Zt6dnRGVXbWA8PvXnZ2dnUVZ_r6dnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>
> "CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
> news:tel9m.15400$8B7.2688@newsfe20.iad...
>>
>> "Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
>> news:HM2dnbpqqKChrvjXnZ2dnUVZ_vSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>>
>>> True enough, but if you have the VRD TVSuite version and
>>> use the DVD functions to extract by title/track you
>>> shouldn't
>>> see that problem.
>>>
>>
>> There is no problem to be seen in VRD+ regarding this matter.
>> Simply choose "auto combine," and "combine" in the Enhanced
>> Plus Features.
>>
>
> The "problem" under discussion was a glitch that the OP
> noted when joining files on the timeline of his NLE. Your
> suggestion (using the "Plus" version of VRD) implied that
> the Join function couldn't be used to solve the problem,
> and you provided your description of how it works.
>
>>> If you want to use the join function, you should first use
>>> VRD to create new .mpg files and join them. They will
>>> start with an I-frame.
>>>
>>
>> Gibberish! Works perfectly as stated above. Why would one
>> *want" to use join, when combine is the documented solution
>> to retaining all frames from a multi-file VTS or split
>> capture?
>>
>
> No one said that "Combine" would not work.
>
> There are a number of reasons for choosing "Join" over
> "Combine".
>
> As the choice appears when dragging & dropping a
> number of files; the files need to be in the order you want
> them, in the combined file. Depending on how the files
> were selected, they may or may not be in the order you
> want. With "Combine" you will not have a chance to
> change the order or add and remove files, before the
> combined file is made. With "Join" you can make such
> adjustments.
>
> The "Join" function is typically used where VRD
> edits or trims a number of related files prior to joining
> them together. Cutting out and joining clips from
> compatible sources is the major use of a "Cut & Join"
> editing program like VRD.
>
> VRD applies a number of "fixes, repairs, optimizations"
> to the MPEG files it processes, by running the files through
> VRD before joining them, all the files will be in a similar
> condition, in that regard. ( And as I mentioned would allow
> the "Join" function to also address the OP's problem.)
>
>> How does this help jmc, who said: he has no idea why one way
>> works and the other does not. Was there something wrong with
>> the answer given? - taken directly from the VRD+ help
>> screens.
>>
>
> It would only help if he were to want to use VRD to
> "Join" or "Combine" files. To extract a title properly
> from a DVD, he should use a program with the correct
> process of extraction. One that makes use of the IFO
> data and allows for the selection of the individual streams
> to be extracted - such as the VRD TVSuite version I
> mentioned.
>
Just to refresh your memory: I replied to jmc, who said that
VRD's join failed while combine worked, but that he did not know
why. I was pretty sure that my answer, derived from the
author's help screen, answered his plight. Your unnecessary
demonstration of the long way around did not clarify that
explanation in the least - if anything, it muddied it.
As I pointed out, the author states that the join function is
intended to handle files from different video sources, the
combine function is intended to handle split files from the same
video source - examples of the latter would be VOBs and captures
to FAT systems; thus the differing treatment of leading p/b
farmes. The original question regarding the "glitch" had to do
with combining VOBs using DVDShrink and/of DVDFab. It had no
mention of files from differing sources.
The only one to mention VRD-TVS was you, and my answer to jmc
was in no way directed toward you.
So once again, your pomposity is dimming your view of this
sub-thread.
Tell either or both of Pierre and jmc something that helps!
Is there some reason one MUST use VRD-TVS over VRD+ simply
because you do? Are you suggesting that VRD+ can not handle
this situation just because you don't know how to use it?
Was there any call whatever to describe a procedure to eliminate
leading p/b frames, when that was the cause of OP's problem and
preserving them was jmc's suggested solution?
"CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
news:HE5am.30437$vp.3408@newsfe12.iad...
>
> "Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:Zt6dnRGVXbWA8PvXnZ2dnUVZ_r6dnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>
>> "CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
>> news:tel9m.15400$8B7.2688@newsfe20.iad...
>>>
>>> "Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
>>> news:HM2dnbpqqKChrvjXnZ2dnUVZ_vSdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>>>
>>>> True enough, but if you have the VRD TVSuite version and
>>>> use the DVD functions to extract by title/track you shouldn't
>>>> see that problem.
>>>>
>>>
>>> There is no problem to be seen in VRD+ regarding this matter. Simply
>>> choose "auto combine," and "combine" in the Enhanced Plus Features.
>>>
>>
>> The "problem" under discussion was a glitch that the OP
>> noted when joining files on the timeline of his NLE. Your
>> suggestion (using the "Plus" version of VRD) implied that
>> the Join function couldn't be used to solve the problem,
>> and you provided your description of how it works.
>>
>>>> If you want to use the join function, you should first use
>>>> VRD to create new .mpg files and join them. They will
>>>> start with an I-frame.
>>>>
>>>
>>> Gibberish! Works perfectly as stated above. Why would one *want" to
>>> use join, when combine is the documented solution to retaining all
>>> frames from a multi-file VTS or split capture?
>>>
>>
>> No one said that "Combine" would not work.
>>
>> There are a number of reasons for choosing "Join" over
>> "Combine".
>>
>> As the choice appears when dragging & dropping a
>> number of files; the files need to be in the order you want
>> them, in the combined file. Depending on how the files
>> were selected, they may or may not be in the order you
>> want. With "Combine" you will not have a chance to
>> change the order or add and remove files, before the
>> combined file is made. With "Join" you can make such
>> adjustments.
>>
>> The "Join" function is typically used where VRD
>> edits or trims a number of related files prior to joining
>> them together. Cutting out and joining clips from
>> compatible sources is the major use of a "Cut & Join"
>> editing program like VRD.
>>
>> VRD applies a number of "fixes, repairs, optimizations"
>> to the MPEG files it processes, by running the files through
>> VRD before joining them, all the files will be in a similar
>> condition, in that regard. ( And as I mentioned would allow
>> the "Join" function to also address the OP's problem.)
>>
>>> How does this help jmc, who said: he has no idea why one way works and
>>> the other does not. Was there something wrong with the answer given? -
>>> taken directly from the VRD+ help screens.
>>>
>>
>> It would only help if he were to want to use VRD to
>> "Join" or "Combine" files. To extract a title properly
>> from a DVD, he should use a program with the correct
>> process of extraction. One that makes use of the IFO
>> data and allows for the selection of the individual streams
>> to be extracted - such as the VRD TVSuite version I
>> mentioned.
>>
>
> Just to refresh your memory: I replied to jmc, who said that VRD's join
> failed while combine worked, but that he did not know why. I was pretty
> sure that my answer, derived from the author's help screen, answered his
> plight. Your unnecessary demonstration of the long way around did not
> clarify that explanation in the least - if anything, it muddied it.
>
> As I pointed out, the author states that the join function is intended to
> handle files from different video sources, the combine function is
> intended to handle split files from the same video source - examples of
> the latter would be VOBs and captures to FAT systems; thus the differing
> treatment of leading p/b farmes. The original question regarding the
> "glitch" had to do with combining VOBs using DVDShrink and/of DVDFab. It
> had no mention of files from differing sources.
>
> The only one to mention VRD-TVS was you, and my answer to jmc was in no
> way directed toward you.
>
"jmc" only mentioned "videoredo", you seem to be implying
that, that must mean VRD+.
> So once again, your pomposity is dimming your view of this sub-thread.
> Tell either or both of Pierre and jmc something that helps!
Both would be better off when extracting the audio and video
streams from a DVD, for editing, if they were to use a program
that properly extracts those streams - and not "Join" OR
"Combine" the separate .vob files.
> Is there some reason one MUST use VRD-TVS over VRD+ simply because you do?
First, see above paragraph. Then note that I not only agreed that
it was possible to do it using the "Combine" function, but also
provided a description of how it can be done using the "Join"
function. You might be advised that the "Combine" and "Join"
functions of VRD-TVS operate exactly the same as they do in VRD+.
(I know this because I have every version that Dan has released.)
> Are you suggesting that VRD+ can not handle this situation just because
> you don't know how to use it?
See above.
> Was there any call whatever to describe a procedure to eliminate leading
> p/b frames, when that was the cause of OP's problem and preserving them
> was jmc's suggested solution?
>
I provided some reasons for using "Join" as opposed to "Combine"
in answer to both "jmc"'s and your direct question. I provided the
procedure for using "Join" after processing each .vob, because you
"didn't know how to use it" to accomplish the objective, given you
posted statements. I don't follow how "preserving them was jmc's
suggested solution", or what you may be trying to say with that
statement.
Pierre: Can anyone tell why I end up with a small glitch at the
splicing
junction whenever I attempt to butt splice two Vob files on the
timeline.
Ken: prime elements features query, followed by VRD-TVS promo
(which of course is a good answer).
Pierre: I can successfully convert all the Vob files with "TMPG
Enc.Express" or (unspecified version of) "VideoReDo" like you
suggested and now I've tried.
Ken: additional info about extraction - even though Pierre is
now satisfied.
jmc: My experience with (unspecified version of) VideoRedo . . .
"combine" leaves no glitch, "join" leaves a glitch. I have no
idea . . . why.
CLicker: quotes VRD+ help to explain why for jmc's edification.
By now it's obvious to everyone that join (as stated in the
except from the VRD help screens) is meant to join discontiguous
a/v that MUST begin with an i-frame (lest orphaned b/p frames be
dropped).
Ken: yes but . . . VRD-TVS is magically better than VRD+ . . .
then explains using VRD to make MPG files which will begin with
i-frames as the right way to use JOIN, which NEVER works when a
subsequent file does not begin with an i-frame, as in Pierre's
case.
How this conversion to MPG and subsequent use of join will
magically incorporate the orphaned b/p frames in Pierre's issue
is ignored. Of course, they were discared by the conversion to
MPG, so they're no longer an issue;-0)
CLicker: Gibberish!
Ken: now explains how join works using scenario of rearranging
scenes and ignoring the "glitch" problem as stated by the OP and
the rest of the thread up to this point. And further ignoring
that noncontiguous a/v joining has already been covered.
CLicker: reiterates
Ken: CLicker's implying that jmc's versionless ref to VDR must
mean +. Of course, Ken is implying that it must mean TVS?
Pot:kettle, eh?
More gibberish about extraction, ignoring the actual method
available and used in VRD of any flavor.
Then informs me that combine and join are available in TVS and
work the same way as in +.
Still does not realize that his "provided procedure" for using
join will not work to preserve orphan b/p frames in Pierre's
scenario.
"CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
news8Gam.132$cf6.37@newsfe16.iad...
> My you're full of yourself;-0)
>
> recap - meant to be brief, but became less than:
>
<Snip Clicker's version of history, the real history is all
here in the thread. >
>
> Still does not realize that his "provided procedure" for using join will
> not work to preserve orphan b/p frames in Pierre's scenario.
>
> Hopeless.
>
Apparently, Clicker is not aware that VideoReDo (VRD)
is a "frame accurate" editing tool. There are no "orphan
frames" created in the process I described. (This assumes
you haven't used the program's preference settings to have
it function as a GOP accurate editor.)
"Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:hrqdnfjLOM0aJ_bXnZ2dnUVZ_vKdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>
> "CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
> news8Gam.132$cf6.37@newsfe16.iad...
>> My you're full of yourself;-0)
>>
>> recap - meant to be brief, but became less than:
>>
>
> <Snip Clicker's version of history, the real history is all
> here in the thread. >
>
>>
>> Still does not realize that his "provided procedure" for
>> using join will not work to preserve orphan b/p frames in
>> Pierre's scenario.
>>
>> Hopeless.
>>
>
> Apparently, Clicker is not aware that VideoReDo (VRD)
> is a "frame accurate" editing tool. There are no "orphan
> frames" created in the process I described. (This assumes
> you haven't used the program's preference settings to have
> it function as a GOP accurate editor.)
>
> Luck;
> Ken
>
>
>
What a [expletive deleted] ;-0) OK, it wasn't an expletive, I
was thinking . . . buffoon.
p/b frames at the beginning of a file which precede the first i
frame are orphaned. Have you been reading this thread or not?
The OP's query regarding his "glitch" when concatenating two
files was properly answered by you in suggesting VRD -
regardless of which version.
When "combining" two files which have been created by
arbitrarily splitting one, VRD of any flavor will concatenate
the orphaned p/b frames, if any, at the beginning of file two
using the last i frame of file one to do so. When "joining,"
using VRD of any flavor, it will drop those frames from file
two - because that is how join works. (Don't blame me for the
semantics, you seem to know the author)
So , apparently you answered Pierre properly without even
knowing why your answer had worked! "Luck," seems an
appropriate sig after all;-) And, since you did not tell him
which to use (combine or join), it's fortunate that he's
knowledgeable enough to read instructions, because he got it
right.
All your blather about how to make "join" work to accomplish
this is total nonsense.
If you process file two of a split, all by itself, and there are
p/b frames preceding its first i frame, how the hell can the
program do anything but discard them? Going through your
machinations accomplishes nothing in this case - which was the
OP's issue and jmc's observation regarding the issue.
Further, if you ask VRD to join cuts from a single file being
edited (notice there is no combine availabe in this case) and
any cut does not start on an i frame, VRD will drop the leading
orphan p/b frames from that cut because it has no i frame from
which to reassemble them.
You're just blinded by your own opinion of yourself!
"CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
news:dQqbm.17470$8B7.15955@newsfe20.iad...
>
> "Ken Maltby" <kmaltby@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:hrqdnfjLOM0aJ_bXnZ2dnUVZ_vKdnZ2d@giganews.com ...
>>
>> "CLicker" <CLicker@invalid.org> wrote in message
>> news8Gam.132$cf6.37@newsfe16.iad...
>>> My you're full of yourself;-0)
>>>
>>> recap - meant to be brief, but became less than:
>>>
>>
>> <Snip Clicker's version of history, the real history is all
>> here in the thread. >
>>
>>>
>>> Still does not realize that his "provided procedure" for using join will
>>> not work to preserve orphan b/p frames in Pierre's scenario.
>>>
>>> Hopeless.
>>>
>>
>> Apparently, Clicker is not aware that VideoReDo (VRD)
>> is a "frame accurate" editing tool. There are no "orphan
>> frames" created in the process I described. (This assumes
>> you haven't used the program's preference settings to have
>> it function as a GOP accurate editor.)
>>
>> Luck;
>> Ken
>>
>>
>>
>
> What a [expletive deleted] ;-0) OK, it wasn't an expletive, I was
> thinking . . . buffoon.
>
> p/b frames at the beginning of a file which precede the first i frame are
> orphaned. Have you been reading this thread or not?
>
> The OP's query regarding his "glitch" when concatenating two files was
> properly answered by you in suggesting VRD - regardless of which version.
>
> When "combining" two files which have been created by arbitrarily
> splitting one, VRD of any flavor will concatenate the orphaned p/b frames,
> if any, at the beginning of file two using the last i frame of file one to
> do so. When "joining," using VRD of any flavor, it will drop those frames
> from file two - because that is how join works. (Don't blame me for the
> semantics, you seem to know the author)
>
> So , apparently you answered Pierre properly without even knowing why your
> answer had worked! "Luck," seems an appropriate sig after all;-) And,
> since you did not tell him which to use (combine or join), it's fortunate
> that he's knowledgeable enough to read instructions, because he got it
> right.
>
> All your blather about how to make "join" work to accomplish this is total
> nonsense.
>
> If you process file two of a split, all by itself, and there are p/b
> frames preceding its first i frame, how the hell can the program do
> anything but discard them? Going through your machinations accomplishes
> nothing in this case - which was the OP's issue and jmc's observation
> regarding the issue.
>
> Further, if you ask VRD to join cuts from a single file being edited
> (notice there is no combine availabe in this case) and any cut does not
> start on an i frame, VRD will drop the leading orphan p/b frames from that
> cut because it has no i frame from which to reassemble them.
>
> You're just blinded by your own opinion of yourself!
>
> Good luck,
>
> CLicker ;-0)
>
You are misstating how VRD works, as well as how
things exist in the real world. You can't have a valid
file made without complete GOPs, even if some are
smaller than the others in the file, they are constructed
with the proper associated files included (in the case of
"closed GOP" files) or just not there to be made "orphans",
in the case of an "open" GOP structure. One of VRD's
exceptional features is that it will reencode the GOPs as
needed to make frame accurate cuts possible, "open" or
"closed" GOP structure.
When VRD makes a cut that you believe would have
left out "leading p/b frames" it reencodes the GOPs
impacted by the cut so that all the frames are included.
Make some cuts (especially from HD MPEG files) and
watch the display as VRD works. Notice that there is a
varying length of time that VRD spends "encoding" as
opposed to the time it spends "fast frame copying". Try
it with it set to the GOP editing mode and notice the
difference.
If your "orphan" frames can be displayed, then VRD
can include them in the new made GOPs, and generate
a new I-frame for them to reference their delta from.
Re: Help with Vob files splicing and glitches 
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