Older Abit AI7 homebuilt acting oddly

On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:04:42 +0000, abit.user
<abit.user@privacy.invalid.com> wrote:


>>> Interesting. Last Easter I stripped down my system to clean and
>>> lubricate all the fans with light oil and a puff of graphite powder.
>>> IIRC one of the fans (probably the PSU) has ball bearings and it
>>> does rattle a little since then. All the sleeve fans are running
>>> very nicely. I must remember that next time :-)
>
>
>>Don't use graphite powder anywhere inside a computer - there is no
>>need for it in a PC and it could potentially do far more harm that
>>good. Graphite is electrically conductive so if it gets anywhere
>>it shouldn't there is no telling what may happen.
>>
>>As for the noise issue, well I've heard it before and I still don't
>>see the rationale for it if you do everything properly in the first
>>instance. Don't use too much and don't use too light a grade.
>>Things like watch oil or WD40 in particular (because it is so
>>prevalent) are far too light for this application and will leak
>>out or evaporate over time, potentially taking some of the existing
>>oil with it. Standard 3 in 1 is good for this task as it is a
>>little heavier. Try to get the mineral oil version rather than
>>the vegetable oil equivalent, although to be honest there isn't a
>>great deal between the two in practice.
>
>Well, I used a small puff of graphite powder and a single drop of 3
>in 1 oil inside the end caps of each sleeve fan with it *outside the
>case* and cleaned each one up afterwards before re-installing. That
>was last Easter and everything is running like magic. Even the PSU
>fan isn't making enough noise to concern me.
>
>I actually followed the lube advice here in this article:
>>http://www.techspot.com/vb/all/windo...stem-fans.html

Graphite is meant for a dry lube, shouldn't be mixed with
oil. Rarely a special lubricating oil will add further
solids but these are often for one of two reasons:

Marketing purposes, add 20 cents of magic material then
claim the lube is worth multiple times as much.

Extreme situations - Not present in a PC fan bearing


Once a fan has worn enough to need relubed the ideal lube is
a synthetic oil as thick as you can find, almost grease
consistency. ~ 80wt Gear oil like you'd find at an
autoparts store is the most popular thing most people might
have locally.

On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:07:07 -0500 'kony'
wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:04:42 +0000, abit.user
><abit.user@privacy.invalid.com> wrote:
>
>
>>>> Interesting. Last Easter I stripped down my system to clean and
>>>> lubricate all the fans with light oil and a puff of graphite powder.
>>>> IIRC one of the fans (probably the PSU) has ball bearings and it
>>>> does rattle a little since then. All the sleeve fans are running
>>>> very nicely. I must remember that next time :-)
>>
>>
>>>Don't use graphite powder anywhere inside a computer - there is no
>>>need for it in a PC and it could potentially do far more harm that
>>>good. Graphite is electrically conductive so if it gets anywhere
>>>it shouldn't there is no telling what may happen.
>>>
>>>As for the noise issue, well I've heard it before and I still don't
>>>see the rationale for it if you do everything properly in the first
>>>instance. Don't use too much and don't use too light a grade.
>>>Things like watch oil or WD40 in particular (because it is so
>>>prevalent) are far too light for this application and will leak
>>>out or evaporate over time, potentially taking some of the existing
>>>oil with it. Standard 3 in 1 is good for this task as it is a
>>>little heavier. Try to get the mineral oil version rather than
>>>the vegetable oil equivalent, although to be honest there isn't a
>>>great deal between the two in practice.


>>Well, I used a small puff of graphite powder and a single drop of 3
>>in 1 oil inside the end caps of each sleeve fan with it *outside the
>>case* and cleaned each one up afterwards before re-installing. That
>>was last Easter and everything is running like magic. Even the PSU
>>fan isn't making enough noise to concern me.
>>
>>I actually followed the lube advice here in this article:
>>>http://www.techspot.com/vb/all/windo...stem-fans.html


>Graphite is meant for a dry lube, shouldn't be mixed with
>oil. Rarely a special lubricating oil will add further
>solids but these are often for one of two reasons:
>
>Marketing purposes, add 20 cents of magic material then
>claim the lube is worth multiple times as much.
>
>Extreme situations - Not present in a PC fan bearing
>
>
>Once a fan has worn enough to need relubed the ideal lube is
>a synthetic oil as thick as you can find, almost grease
>consistency. ~ 80wt Gear oil like you'd find at an
>autoparts store is the most popular thing most people might
>have locally.

Well, I hear what you say and also Andrew's previous comments but
it is the case that my fans run very nicely after the treatment with
graphite and oil.

In view of your comments, I'm stuck to know what to use in future!

On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 12:47:02 +0000, abit.user
<abit.user@privacy.invalid.com> wrote:

>
>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:07:07 -0500 'kony'
>wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
>
>>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:04:42 +0000, abit.user
>><abit.user@privacy.invalid.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>>> Interesting. Last Easter I stripped down my system to clean and
>>>>> lubricate all the fans with light oil and a puff of graphite powder.
>>>>> IIRC one of the fans (probably the PSU) has ball bearings and it
>>>>> does rattle a little since then. All the sleeve fans are running
>>>>> very nicely. I must remember that next time :-)
>>>
>>>
>>>>Don't use graphite powder anywhere inside a computer - there is no
>>>>need for it in a PC and it could potentially do far more harm that
>>>>good. Graphite is electrically conductive so if it gets anywhere
>>>>it shouldn't there is no telling what may happen.
>>>>
>>>>As for the noise issue, well I've heard it before and I still don't
>>>>see the rationale for it if you do everything properly in the first
>>>>instance. Don't use too much and don't use too light a grade.
>>>>Things like watch oil or WD40 in particular (because it is so
>>>>prevalent) are far too light for this application and will leak
>>>>out or evaporate over time, potentially taking some of the existing
>>>>oil with it. Standard 3 in 1 is good for this task as it is a
>>>>little heavier. Try to get the mineral oil version rather than
>>>>the vegetable oil equivalent, although to be honest there isn't a
>>>>great deal between the two in practice.
>
>
>>>Well, I used a small puff of graphite powder and a single drop of 3
>>>in 1 oil inside the end caps of each sleeve fan with it *outside the
>>>case* and cleaned each one up afterwards before re-installing. That
>>>was last Easter and everything is running like magic. Even the PSU
>>>fan isn't making enough noise to concern me.
>>>
>>>I actually followed the lube advice here in this article:
>>>>http://www.techspot.com/vb/all/windo...stem-fans.html
>
>
>>Graphite is meant for a dry lube, shouldn't be mixed with
>>oil. Rarely a special lubricating oil will add further
>>solids but these are often for one of two reasons:
>>
>>Marketing purposes, add 20 cents of magic material then
>>claim the lube is worth multiple times as much.
>>
>>Extreme situations - Not present in a PC fan bearing
>>
>>
>>Once a fan has worn enough to need relubed the ideal lube is
>>a synthetic oil as thick as you can find, almost grease
>>consistency. ~ 80wt Gear oil like you'd find at an
>>autoparts store is the most popular thing most people might
>>have locally.
>
>Well, I hear what you say and also Andrew's previous comments but
>it is the case that my fans run very nicely after the treatment with
>graphite and oil.
>
>In view of your comments, I'm stuck to know what to use in future!

I don't doubt that they do work ok for now, but the bearing
has small pores into which the oil will seep (if it's not
clogged by solids like graphite) which is good as it means
more retention in the bearing and if the bearing where to
start drying out it still has more reserve oil in it, and
over the long term it should be worse to have solids
clogging the pores IF it has any effect at all. These are
not new ideas to the PC/fan world, the basics of lubrication
have been around and extensively tested for 100 years and
more - though also in the PC/fan industry the worlds most
respected fan manufacturers do not put graphite in their
bearing lube which should say enough by itself, since
graphite isn't especially rare or expensive.

If you wanted to mix something into the oil, mix some
synthetic grease in, just enough that the drop-point of the
grease is below the ambient temp. It's not really necessary
that it be synthetic, but it does tend to remain more stable
given some heat and time.

The thinner base oil will then seep into the bearing more
with the thicker portion remaining more around the thrust
bearing helping to keep all the lube where it does the most
good instead of running out. In certain situations (like
some power supplies that come with cheap 120mm sleeve
bearing fans in them, or video card fans) using such a lube,
preemptively rather than waiting till the bearing is worn
down, can add quite a bit longer interval between subsequent
servicing... though ideally it's better to just replace any
marginal video card fans as they are often pretty poor even
in their best condition, turning too fast and wobbling too
much on too narrow a bearing in a horizontal position.

On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 08:35:00 -0500 'kony'
wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:

>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 12:47:02 +0000, abit.user
><abit.user@privacy.invalid.com> wrote:
>
>>
>>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:07:07 -0500 'kony'
>>wrote this on alt.comp.periphs.mainboard.abit:
>>
>>>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:04:42 +0000, abit.user
>>><abit.user@privacy.invalid.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>>> Interesting. Last Easter I stripped down my system to clean and
>>>>>> lubricate all the fans with light oil and a puff of graphite powder.
>>>>>> IIRC one of the fans (probably the PSU) has ball bearings and it
>>>>>> does rattle a little since then. All the sleeve fans are running
>>>>>> very nicely. I must remember that next time :-)
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Don't use graphite powder anywhere inside a computer - there is no
>>>>>need for it in a PC and it could potentially do far more harm that
>>>>>good. Graphite is electrically conductive so if it gets anywhere
>>>>>it shouldn't there is no telling what may happen.
>>>>>
>>>>>As for the noise issue, well I've heard it before and I still don't
>>>>>see the rationale for it if you do everything properly in the first
>>>>>instance. Don't use too much and don't use too light a grade.
>>>>>Things like watch oil or WD40 in particular (because it is so
>>>>>prevalent) are far too light for this application and will leak
>>>>>out or evaporate over time, potentially taking some of the existing
>>>>>oil with it. Standard 3 in 1 is good for this task as it is a
>>>>>little heavier. Try to get the mineral oil version rather than
>>>>>the vegetable oil equivalent, although to be honest there isn't a
>>>>>great deal between the two in practice.
>>
>>
>>>>Well, I used a small puff of graphite powder and a single drop of 3
>>>>in 1 oil inside the end caps of each sleeve fan with it *outside the
>>>>case* and cleaned each one up afterwards before re-installing. That
>>>>was last Easter and everything is running like magic. Even the PSU
>>>>fan isn't making enough noise to concern me.
>>>>
>>>>I actually followed the lube advice here in this article:
>>>>>http://www.techspot.com/vb/all/windo...stem-fans.html
>>
>>
>>>Graphite is meant for a dry lube, shouldn't be mixed with
>>>oil. Rarely a special lubricating oil will add further
>>>solids but these are often for one of two reasons:
>>>
>>>Marketing purposes, add 20 cents of magic material then
>>>claim the lube is worth multiple times as much.
>>>
>>>Extreme situations - Not present in a PC fan bearing
>>>
>>>
>>>Once a fan has worn enough to need relubed the ideal lube is
>>>a synthetic oil as thick as you can find, almost grease
>>>consistency. ~ 80wt Gear oil like you'd find at an
>>>autoparts store is the most popular thing most people might
>>>have locally.
>>
>>Well, I hear what you say and also Andrew's previous comments but
>>it is the case that my fans run very nicely after the treatment with
>>graphite and oil.
>>
>>In view of your comments, I'm stuck to know what to use in future!
>
>I don't doubt that they do work ok for now, but the bearing
>has small pores into which the oil will seep (if it's not
>clogged by solids like graphite) which is good as it means
>more retention in the bearing and if the bearing where to
>start drying out it still has more reserve oil in it, and
>over the long term it should be worse to have solids
>clogging the pores IF it has any effect at all. These are
>not new ideas to the PC/fan world, the basics of lubrication
>have been around and extensively tested for 100 years and
>more - though also in the PC/fan industry the worlds most
>respected fan manufacturers do not put graphite in their
>bearing lube which should say enough by itself, since
>graphite isn't especially rare or expensive.
>
>If you wanted to mix something into the oil, mix some
>synthetic grease in, just enough that the drop-point of the
>grease is below the ambient temp. It's not really necessary
>that it be synthetic, but it does tend to remain more stable
>given some heat and time.
>
>The thinner base oil will then seep into the bearing more
>with the thicker portion remaining more around the thrust
>bearing helping to keep all the lube where it does the most
>good instead of running out. In certain situations (like
>some power supplies that come with cheap 120mm sleeve
>bearing fans in them, or video card fans) using such a lube,
>preemptively rather than waiting till the bearing is worn
>down, can add quite a bit longer interval between subsequent
>servicing... though ideally it's better to just replace any
>marginal video card fans as they are often pretty poor even
>in their best condition, turning too fast and wobbling too
>much on too narrow a bearing in a horizontal position.

Thanks kony, I'll keep your comments for the next time I
do some lubrication. Much appreciated.

On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:02:27 -0500, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:

[SNIP]
>The situation changes when dealing with different kinds of
>fan bearings not seen in PC fans. With larger fans such as
>in a HVAC unit you will find much larger bearings and the
>fans are typically relubed preventatively instead of after
>the bearing is shot, and the bearing cup has a felt or
>equivalent matting to hold the lubricant. In that case the
>lubricant has to be thin enough to flow through the matting.
>Since a PC fan's reservoir has no such matting but only
>gravity to assist it, the thicker the oil the more it will
>stay where it's supposed to.

Don't they use sintered metal bearings in fans any more?

On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 19:28:46 -0500, Strobe
<Strobe@nyc.Beep!Beep!.com> wrote:

>On Sun, 06 Jan 2008 00:02:27 -0500, kony <spam@spam.com> wrote:
>
>[SNIP]
>>The situation changes when dealing with different kinds of
>>fan bearings not seen in PC fans. With larger fans such as
>>in a HVAC unit you will find much larger bearings and the
>>fans are typically relubed preventatively instead of after
>>the bearing is shot, and the bearing cup has a felt or
>>equivalent matting to hold the lubricant. In that case the
>>lubricant has to be thin enough to flow through the matting.
>>Since a PC fan's reservoir has no such matting but only
>>gravity to assist it, the thicker the oil the more it will
>>stay where it's supposed to.
>
>Don't they use sintered metal bearings in fans any more?


yes, and?