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Guest
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 Posted: Fri Apr 20, 2007 12:29 am Post subject: Custom Cable tv |
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Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
Is anyone doing this already.....
Thank you for any information..
Dominic |
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Eric
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 7:34 pm Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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On Apr 19, 5:20 pm, demie...@yahoo.com wrote:
| Quote: | Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
Is anyone doing this already.....
Thank you for any information..
Dominic
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You are not permitted to go beyond the ground block (also known as the
demarcation point). The cable company "owns" the drop going to the
house. Other than that, knock yourself out. Just keep in mind that you
become responsible for the inside wiring, and if it is not up to cable
company standards, they can and will disconnect it (or at least blame
you for any and all problems the customer may have).
If you want to become a contractor for the cable company, that's a
different story. You'll need lots of insurance, specific tools, and a
high tolerance for being treated like scum. |
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Guest
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 8:44 pm Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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On Apr 21, 7:34 am, Eric <egruml...@gmail.com> wrote:
| Quote: | On Apr 19, 5:20 pm, demie...@yahoo.com wrote:
Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
Is anyone doing this already.....
Thank you for any information..
Dominic
You are not permitted to go beyond the ground block (also known as the
demarcation point). The cable company "owns" the drop going to the
house. Other than that, knock yourself out. Just keep in mind that you
become responsible for the inside wiring, and if it is not up to cable
company standards, they can and will disconnect it (or at least blame
you for any and all problems the customer may have).
If you want to become a contractor for the cable company, that's a
different story. You'll need lots of insurance, specific tools, and a
high tolerance for being treated like scum.
|
Do you mean from the ground block up to pole or down to tap... I'm
assuming..?
you can work from the ground block inward right without any problems??
Also, do you know if there is something differnt you need to know when
working on Boats or Yachts' ? I did a small job on a Yacht, that was
behind the owners house, ( just a relocate ) but I not up on what
would be needed to work on custom jobs on Yachts....any Info?
Thanks again for your input; and I was thinking of doing something
with a lawyer, that would state and be signed by the customer that
they must contact the local cable company to activate this custom
line. This would hopefully free me from any problems with the Carries.
Dominic |
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Whomever
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 10:04 pm Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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I'm not so sure that's true of all providers. Here in Tampa Bright House is
responsible for all the wiring, all the way to the attachment to the modem
or tv. They ran the cable for me from the pole to the junction on the house
and then up thru the attic, down the wall and to the cable modem.
"Eric" <egrumling@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1177166090.324731.142850@n76g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | On Apr 19, 5:20 pm, demie...@yahoo.com wrote:
Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
Is anyone doing this already.....
Thank you for any information..
Dominic
You are not permitted to go beyond the ground block (also known as the
demarcation point). The cable company "owns" the drop going to the
house. Other than that, knock yourself out. Just keep in mind that you
become responsible for the inside wiring, and if it is not up to cable
company standards, they can and will disconnect it (or at least blame
you for any and all problems the customer may have).
If you want to become a contractor for the cable company, that's a
different story. You'll need lots of insurance, specific tools, and a
high tolerance for being treated like scum.
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Timothy Daniels
Guest
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| Posted: Sat Apr 21, 2007 11:47 pm Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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"Whomever" wrote:
| Quote: | I'm not so sure that's true of all providers. Here in Tampa
Bright House is responsible for all the wiring, all the way to
the attachment to the modem or tv. They ran the cable for
me from the pole to the junction on the house and then up
thru the attic, down the wall and to the cable modem.
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If they supply the parts and labor for the in-house wiring,
they can probably legally retrieve it and/or prevent you from
using it for satellite reception if you should close your account
with them. Here in L.A., our condo HOA chose to hire our
own cablers to put in the cable when we heard how the cable
company's yahoos were going to route the cables. 15 years
later, when dbs satellite was introduced, the cable company
wanted us to sign a 20-year exclusive use agreement in return
for a cheap bulk account. But, we reasoned that no such "gift"
is really free, and we turned them down. We eventually found
out that they had realized that *we* owned our cabling and they
wanted to block us from using it for satellite. Then, 5 yrs later,
we added a satellite system - that uses the same cabling. We
wouldn't have been able to do that if the cable company had
installed our cabling.
*TimDaniels* |
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Timothy Daniels
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 12:13 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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"$Bill" wrote:
| Quote: | Timothy Daniels wrote:
If they supply the parts and labor for the in-house wiring,
they can probably legally retrieve it and/or prevent you from
using it for satellite reception if you should close your account
with them.
I doubt that very much - as far as I'm concerned that's donated
cabling if they didn't charge you for it and if they charged you
for it, then it's obviously yours. They are entitled to get their
boxes (set top, modem, etc) back, but that's it.
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What's the legal difference between the "boxes" and the cabling?
I recently stopped the installation for a cable TV/Internet account
because the idiot installer had broken into our condo association's
OTA cabling system to facilitate a room-to-room cable extension.
His supervisor told him to rip out all the cabling that he had put in
and to vacate the premises. Eventually, his company made the
supervisor come out and repair the damage to our OTA cabling,
but it wasn't until Time Warner had established that *we* owned
all of our cabling. Apparently, the legal department has advised
Time Warner that what cables they put in they are free to break
into and rip out.
*TimDaniels* |
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$Bill
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 12:13 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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Timothy Daniels wrote:
| Quote: |
If they supply the parts and labor for the in-house wiring,
they can probably legally retrieve it and/or prevent you from
using it for satellite reception if you should close your account
with them.
|
I doubt that very much - as far as I'm concerned that's donated cabling
if they didn't charge you for it and if they charged you for it, then it's
obviously yours. They are entitled to get their boxes (set top, modem, etc)
back, but that's it. |
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$Bill
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:19 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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Timothy Daniels wrote:
| Quote: |
What's the legal difference between the "boxes" and the cabling?
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You're renting the boxes (set top, modem, etc). |
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Dana
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:40 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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<demierid@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1177024819.770883.42400@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
| Quote: | Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
|
Where are you planning on getting the content you want to distribute.
There are ways that you can obtain a license from a satellite provider to
offer content tou your future subs.
| Quote: | Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
|
You cannot redistribute their signal.
| Quote: | Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
|
You may be able to be a contractor for them
| Quote: | Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
|
But it is not your to take.
| Quote: |
Is anyone doing this already.....
Thank you for any information..
Dominic
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Timothy Daniels
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:48 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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"$Bill" wrote:
| Quote: | Timothy Daniels wrote:
What's the legal difference between the "boxes" and
the cabling?
You're renting the boxes (set top, modem, etc).
|
Not I. My modem is my own. And when I went in to
Time Warner to get one of their modems, they handed me
a modem without any charge, and no charge for the modem
appeared on my bill. Use of their modem is part of my
subscription, and they could just as well argue that the use
of their cabling (if they had put it in) was also part of my
subscription.
*TimDaniels* |
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Warren H
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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Timothy Daniels wrote:
| Quote: | If they supply the parts and labor for the in-house wiring,
they can probably legally retrieve it and/or prevent you from
using it for satellite reception if you should close your account
with them. Here in L.A., our condo HOA chose to hire our
own cablers to put in the cable when we heard how the cable
company's yahoos were going to route the cables. 15 years
later, when dbs satellite was introduced, the cable company
wanted us to sign a 20-year exclusive use agreement in return
for a cheap bulk account. But, we reasoned that no such "gift"
is really free, and we turned them down. We eventually found
out that they had realized that *we* owned our cabling and they
wanted to block us from using it for satellite. Then, 5 yrs later,
we added a satellite system - that uses the same cabling. We
wouldn't have been able to do that if the cable company had
installed our cabling.
|
An apartment building, condo development, co-op, and common areas of an
HOA are very different than a single residential unit. In a single
residential unit, cabling installed ceases to be personal property, and
becomes part of the real property. In the other situations, the cabling
remains personal property or trade fixtures.
The cable company can only get back the cabling *installed* in a single
residential unit if they had a lien against the property. Even then,
they would need to restore the property to it's prior condition, or pay
for damages. And they'd have to provide the labor. That's way, way
beyond what it costs to just allow the cable to become part of the real
property it's installed in. And once it's part of the real property you
own, you can repurpose it for whatever you like, as long as you
disconnect it from their network.
In the case of multi-unit residential properties, things are different.
In your state a duplex or even a four-plex may still fall under the same
rules as a single family home, but I don't believe that there are any
states where anything larger than a four-plex doesn't fall under
different property rules. And the common areas of a condo association,
co-op, or HOA definitely don't enjoy the same protections as single
family property in any state. In those situations, they most likely can
retain ownership of the cabling. They may have to restore any damage
done if they remove it, but they may also be able to elect to leave it
in place, but still prevent it from being repurposed.
As for the cable boxes and cable modems, they aren't installed in the
real property. They are mealy connected to the cable. The cable company
may also ask for that short length of cable that you connect between the
boxes and the coax outlet in the wall, as it isn't installed in the real
property, either.
If you want to confirm my interpretation of the difference between cable
installed in a single unit and a multi unit, and at what point the
distinction is made in your state, consult an attorney specializing in
real estate issues. But as for the difference in legal status between
the cable installed in a home, and the modem that's just placed there,
any licensed real estate broker should be qualified to give you a
definitive answer on that one. (And if they aren't, your state needs
better licensing standards.)
--
Warren H.
==========
Disclaimer: My views reflect those of myself, and not my
employer, my friends, nor (as she often tells me) my wife.
Any resemblance to the views of anybody living or dead is
coincidental. No animals were hurt in the writing of this
response -- unless you count my dog who desperately wants
to go outside now.
Maintain your landscape with Black & Decker:
http://www.holzemville.com/mall/blackanddecker |
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$Bill
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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Timothy Daniels wrote:
| Quote: |
Not I. My modem is my own. And when I went in to
Time Warner to get one of their modems, they handed me
a modem without any charge, and no charge for the modem
appeared on my bill. Use of their modem is part of my
subscription, and they could just as well argue that the use
of their cabling (if they had put it in) was also part of my
subscription.
|
Not gonna happen. Did you sign a receipt when they installed your
wiring ? No, of course not. They can only take back boxes that
they have provided for you. There's no way they would try to
force their way into your home and remove wiring. Not to mention
that they would want to leave it there in case you moved. |
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Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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On Apr 21, 9:40 pm, "Dana" <raff...@yahoo.com> wrote:
| Quote: | demie...@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1177024819.770883.42400@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
Where are you planning on getting the content you want to distribute.
There are ways that you can obtain a license from a satellite provider to
offer content tou your future subs.
Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
You cannot redistribute their signal.
Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
You may be able to be a contractor for them
Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
But it is not your to take.
Is anyone doing this already.....
Thank you for any information..
Dominic- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
|
I would like to get back to just my question,
Does anyone really know the laws or rules of installing, from the
ground block, " inward ?"
Say, a home owner wanted a TV in her Kitchen? or like my brother in
his Closet....?
Just running a simple customer more professional look.
Again, thank you for any feed back..
Dominic
added.... I think if I was to get the customer to sign, that they will
contact the local provider to activate, then I think this would clear
all problem of my company stealing their signal... right?
Thanks |
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$Bill
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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Dana wrote:
| Quote: | demierid@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1177024819.770883.42400@l77g2000hsb.googlegroups.com...
Me friend and I are interested in starting a custom cable ( TV )
company, just simple in home custom installs.
Where are you planning on getting the content you want to distribute.
There are ways that you can obtain a license from a satellite provider to
offer content tou your future subs.
|
He's not distributing - he's offering home cable running services.
He's just wiring people's houses for them.
| Quote: | Does anyone know if this is possible? Are there laws or rules in place
by the cable companies that will not allow this.
You cannot redistribute their signal.
Is there a way to do it with them but not work for them on their
appts.
You may be able to be a contractor for them
Maybe give them a percent, or some legal papers so they don't think
the customer is stealing form them, even though we all know it is out
ther everywhere.
But it is not your to take. |
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Warren H
Guest
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| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2007 9:49 am Post subject: Re: Custom Cable tv |
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demierid@yahoo.com wrote:
| Quote: | I would like to get back to just my question,
Does anyone really know the laws or rules of installing, from the
ground block, " inward ?"
Say, a home owner wanted a TV in her Kitchen? or like my brother in
his Closet....?
Just running a simple customer more professional look.
Again, thank you for any feed back..
|
A customer is allowed to provide their own inside cabling. They can do
it themselves, or hire a contractor to do it.
However, most cable companies will install inside cabling as part of
their regular installation charge. Perhaps it'll be a flat rate. Perhaps
it'll be a per-outlet rate. But generally it's going to cost less to
just let the cable company handle it than it would be to hire their own
contractor.
Also, if there is a problem, and the cable company finds it to be a
result of improper cabling, at that time they may charge an hourly rate
to re-do it to their specifications. And if they find that improper
cabling in someone's house is causing a problem for someone else, they
can simply disconnect the problem house.
Also, when the cable company does the installation themselves, if
there's a problem with the signal at the drop, they can fix that
problem. You wouldn't be able to offer that service. This could also
result in the customer essentially double-paying.
The only benefit to the customer is that (presumably) you will listen to
their special requests. For example, the cable company may only be
willing to run a cable along the outside of a baseboard, but the
customer may want it fished through the wall. (Of course if you're
charging extra for extra work, the customer may decide that it isn't
worth it!)
Remember you'll need a contractor's license in any state. In many places
you'll need a local business license, too. (Perhaps multiple business
licenses if you work in multiple municipalities.) You may also need to
have performance bonding. You'll need insurance. You'll have to file all
the right paperwork for licenses and taxes, and if you hire someone to
help you, you'll need to comply with all the payroll laws, workers comp
laws, unemployment insurance, etc.
And then there's the question of how will you find your customers? Will
there be enough customers willing to pay what you need to charge to make
a profit?
A related idea would be instead of installing cable TV cabling, install
home theaters. While most stores selling home theater components have
already hooked-up with a contractor(s), and then market those services
to people buying home theaters, your particular local market may still
have room for one more contractor. (My guess would be that for most of
these contractors, residential jobs are their least profitable jobs, and
their most profitable jobs are commercial communications installations,
and they get those jobs because of significant networking over many
years, and many adaptations of their business as times have changed over
the years.)
Starting any business can be a very big undertaking. Operating the
business itself may prove to be more work than the actual service you're
reselling. And yes, discovering whether your idea is even viable is a
lot of work in itself. While asking here might get you some ideas, the
help you'll get here barely scratches the surface of what you'll need to
create a successful business.
So essentially, your idea isn't all that new of an idea. It probably
wouldn't be profitable as your only service. There are almost certainly
well established companies that you'd be competing against if you go
after the more profitable related services. And you may find the
contractor and business licensing processes, and operation of the
business itself to be more difficult than the work itself.
In other words, if your business experience is akin to going door to
door to rake leaves or shovel snow, your idea, while interesting, is
going to be harder to successfully implement than you may be capable of.
(And I base that on the fact that you're asking people in a cable modem
newsgroup instead of something more appropriate for entrepreneurial
questions.)
--
Warren H.
==========
Disclaimer: My views reflect those of myself, and not my
employer, my friends, nor (as she often tells me) my wife.
Any resemblance to the views of anybody living or dead is
coincidental. No animals were hurt in the writing of this
response -- unless you count my dog who desperately wants
to go outside now.
Maintain your landscape with Black & Decker:
http://www.holzemville.com/mall/blackanddecker |
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